misha@daisy.UUCP (Mike Umansky) (02/19/86)
Hi. A question for all who know: I heard on this net that there is a pilot StarTrek episode titled: "The Cage". Pieces of this episode were used in the two-part sequence where Spock abducts his former captain. Has this episode ever been shown in full? Under same name?? Is it available on video cassette?? Thanx. PS: Also, if it is true that the next StarTrek movie will be shot in San Francisco and Monterey, can anyone supply the actual dates of the shootings and maybe detailed locations!!! Thanks. -- -- NAME: Michael Umansky (misha) E-MAIL: ucbvax!hplabs!nsc!daisy!misha WORK: Daisy Systems Corp. 700B Middlefield Road Mountain View, CA 94039-7006 (415) 960-7166 (work) HOME: 94 Cassia Ct. Hayward, CA 94544 (415) 886-4805 (home)
boyajian@akov68.DEC (JERRY BOYAJIAN) (02/25/86)
> From: daisy!misha (Michael Umansky) > I heard on this net that there is a pilot StarTrek episode > titled: "The Cage". Pieces of this episode were used in > the two-part sequence where Spock abducts his former captain. > Has this episode ever been shown in full? Under same name?? > Is it available on video cassette?? "The Cage", as such, has never been shown on tv. As I understand it, prints of it have been shown at Star Trek Conventions. Supposedly, no color prints of it exist any more, only black-and-white. It is not available on videocassette as yet, though I wouldn't be surprised if Paramount decided to release it on tape as part of the set of tapes (after all, we need a tape with a "1" on the spine, to complete the set, don't we? :-)). Oddly enough, the other week I was watching my tape of "The Menagerie" and timed the "Cage" sequences (it's nice having a vcr with a real-time counter). Turns out that there's ~50 minutes worth of "The Cage" used in "The Menagerie", which means that "The Cage" must have been slightly longer than a normal tv episode. It wouldn't be easy to reconstruct a print of "The Cage" by cannibalizing "The Menagerie", though, since some of the "Cage" footage does not take up the full tv screen, but only shows up as a picture within a picture. --- jayembee (Jerry Boyajian, DEC, Acton-Nagog, MA) UUCP: {decvax|ihnp4|allegra|ucbvax|...} !decwrl!dec-rhea!dec-akov68!boyajian ARPA: boyajian%akov68.DEC@DECWRL.DEC.COM
elb@mtx5d.UUCP (Ellen Bart) (02/27/86)
> Turns out that there's ~50 minutes worth of "The Cage" used > in "The Menagerie", which means that "The Cage" must have been slightly > longer than a normal tv episode. It wouldn't be easy to reconstruct a > > --- jayembee (Jerry Boyajian, DEC, Acton-Nagog, MA) > Interesting fact I picked up from the James Blish novelization of The Cage in which he restored the story's original ending. After Pike is shown Vina as she really is, he says you'll give her back her illusion of beauty won't you? The Keeper replies "And More". (now that always bothered me in the Menagerie because she doesn't look *more* beautiful or more of anything) Well, in the original, Vina walks back to the elevator - as beautiful as before *AND* accompanied by a *duplicate* of Pike !! (That's where they got the scene of the supposedly *rehabilitated* Pike with Vina that's shown at the very end of the Menagerie!!) Romantic that I am (see previous posting on Private Little War) I really love that as an ending. Interesting also that The Cage is the only ST story that *won* a Hugo award (though there are others that were nominated) Happy Treking. Ellen Bart (lots of things)!mtx5d!elb
dayoung@hplabsc.UUCP (Doug A. Young) (02/27/86)
> > > From: daisy!misha (Michael Umansky) > > > I heard on this net that there is a pilot StarTrek episode > > titled: "The Cage". Pieces of this episode were used in > > the two-part sequence where Spock abducts his former captain. > > Has this episode ever been shown in full? Under same name?? > > Is it available on video cassette?? > > "The Cage", as such, has never been shown on tv. As I understand it, > prints of it have been shown at Star Trek Conventions. Supposedly, no > color prints of it exist any more, only black-and-white. It is not > available on videocassette as yet, though I wouldn't be surprised if > Paramount decided to release it on tape as part of the set of tapes > (after all, we need a tape with a "1" on the spine, to complete the > set, don't we? :-)). > > Oddly enough, the other week I was watching my tape of "The Menagerie" > and timed the "Cage" sequences (it's nice having a vcr with a real-time > counter). Turns out that there's ~50 minutes worth of "The Cage" used > in "The Menagerie", which means that "The Cage" must have been slightly > longer than a normal tv episode. It wouldn't be easy to reconstruct a > print of "The Cage" by cannibalizing "The Menagerie", though, since > some of the "Cage" footage does not take up the full tv screen, but > only shows up as a picture within a picture. > > --- jayembee (Jerry Boyajian, DEC, Acton-Nagog, MA) > > UUCP: {decvax|ihnp4|allegra|ucbvax|...} > !decwrl!dec-rhea!dec-akov68!boyajian > ARPA: boyajian%akov68.DEC@DECWRL.DEC.COM I attended a talk by Gene Rodenberyy in Cleveland a few years ago, and he concluded by showing The Cage in its entirety. It was actually a bit disappointing, because I dont believe anything (at least nothing consequential) was cut when they made "The Menagerie", so there was nothing new. If you've seen The Menagerie, you've seen The Cage. Incidently the film I saw was in black and white. from: dayoung@hplabs Doug Young, HPLABS, Palo Alto
john@moncol.UUCP (John Ruschmeyer) (03/01/86)
In article <1360@decwrl.DEC.COM> boyajian@akov68.DEC (JERRY BOYAJIAN) writes: > > ............It wouldn't be easy to reconstruct a >print of "The Cage" by cannibalizing "The Menagerie", though, since >some of the "Cage" footage does not take up the full tv screen, but >only shows up as a picture within a picture. Actually, that depends on your views on colorization of B&W prints (using as much real color footage as possible) and/or watching a 60+ minute show with, say, 10 minutes of B&W footage interspersed. There are Doctor Who fans who would kill to see many episodes even if they were in such a screwy format. Trek fans are not as used to missing episodes, since "The Cage" is the only one and it's not totally missing. -- Name: John Ruschmeyer US Mail: Monmouth College, W. Long Branch, NJ 07764 Phone: (201) 571-3451 UUCP: ...!vax135!petsd!moncol!john ...!princeton!moncol!john ...!pesnta!moncol!john Give an ape control of its environment and it will fill the world with bananas.
barmar@mit-eddie.UUCP (Barry Margolin) (03/02/86)
In article <746@mtx5d.UUCP> elb@mtx5d.UUCP (Ellen Bart) writes: >Well, in the original, Vina walks back to the elevator - as beautiful >as before *AND* accompanied by a *duplicate* of Pike !! I've always liked that scene, too. >Interesting also that The Cage is the only ST story that *won* a Hugo >award (though there are others that were nominated) I thought Harlan Ellison's original teleplay of "City on the Edge of Forever" held that distinction. -- Barry Margolin ARPA: barmar@MIT-Multics UUCP: ..!genrad!mit-eddie!barmar
ccrdave@ucdavis.UUCP (Lord Kahless @ Imperial Propoganda) (03/03/86)
> > Interesting also that The Cage is the only ST story that *won* a Hugo > award (though there are others that were nominated) > > Ellen Bart > (lots of things)!mtx5d!elb *** REPLACE THIS LINE WITH YOUR OFFICIAL CORRECTION *** According to Asimov's "The Hugo Winners," Star Trek won the best dramatic presentation award in 1968 for "City on the Edge of Forever." They list Harlan Ellison as the author, although the decision was based on the Roddenberry script that was aired.
ins_bbdg@jhunix.UUCP (James T. Kirk) (03/04/86)
[Replace this line with your favorite redshirt] > Interesting also that The Cage is the only ST story that *won* a Hugo > award (though there are others that were nominated) > > Happy Treking. > > Ellen Bart David Gerrold (author Trouble with Tribbles) said in his book, the Trouble with Tribbles, that his story came in second in a competition with City On The Edge Of Forever for the Hugo. Please correct me if either I or he is wrong. -- Lad, you're gonna need somethin' ta wash thaet down with. Y'ever try any Saurian Brandy? UUCP: seismo!umcp-cs \ BITNET: INS_BBDG@JHUVMS ihnp4!whuxcc > !jhunix!ins_bbdg P13I2691@JHUVM allegra!hopkins / CSNET: ins_bbdg@jhunix.CSNET ARPA: ins_bbdg%jhunix.BITNET@wiscvm.WISC.EDU
friedman@uiucdcs.CS.UIUC.EDU (03/04/86)
> I attended a talk by Gene Rodenberyy in Cleveland a few years ago, and > he concluded by showing The Cage in its entirety. It was actually a bit > disappointing, because I dont believe anything (at least nothing > consequential) was cut when they made "The Menagerie", so there was nothing > new. If you've seen The Menagerie, you've seen The Cage. Incidently the > film I saw was in black and white. > from: dayoung@hplabs Doug Young, HPLABS, Palo Alto I also have attended one of GR's talks, and seen the B&W print of The Cage. I suppose it's the same one he shows most any time he gives a ST talk. But if you didn't notice any "new" scenes, you missed out, assuming you saw the same thing I saw. (Or maybe your judgement about what is "consequential" is different from mine.) The scene that stands out in my mind is a scene on the Enterprise bridge after the attempt to beam down to the planet, when the women were transported and the men were left behind. A very excited (emotional!) Spock decides that it is too dangerous to remain in orbit around Talos IV, and orders the ship to leave. I vaguely recall that they then lost power, and so were unable to leave orbit. Then later, when the women beam back (after the final scene on the planet surface), someone says "Mr. Spock, systems are coming on." (Or something close to that.) In The Menagerie, that remark never quite seemed to make sense; this bridge scene puts it into its proper context. H. George Friedman, Jr. Department of Computer Science University of Illinois at Urbana-Champaign 1304 West Springfield Avenue Urbana, Illinois 61801 USENET: ...!{pur-ee,ihnp4,convex}!uiucdcs!friedman CSNET: friedman%uiuc@csnet-relay.arpa ARPA: friedman@uiuc.arpa
mnw@trwrba.UUCP (Michael N. Washington) (03/04/86)
In article <122@hplabsc.UUCP> dayoung@hplabsc.UUCP (Doug A. Young) writes: > >I attended a talk by Gene Rodenberyy in Cleveland a few years ago, and >he concluded by showing The Cage in its entirety. It was actually a bit >disappointing, because I dont believe anything (at least nothing >consequential) was cut when they made "The Menagerie", so there was nothing >new. If you've seen The Menagerie, you've seen The Cage. Incidently the >film I saw was in black and white. > > from: dayoung@hplabs Doug Young, HPLABS, Palo Alto I saw "The Cage" also at a Star Trek convention. I disagree with Doug Young. Although most of the " Menagerie" was cannibalized from the "Cage", it left out some of the light humor. The copy that I saw was in B/W. Mrs. Roddenberry (Majel Barrett) said the color print was lost. "Live Long and Prosper!" Michael N. Washington TRW E&DS Redondo Beach, Ca. 90278 {ucbvax,decvax,hplabs}!trwrb!trwrba!mnw
daemon@houligan.UUCP (03/07/86)
> > I attended a talk by Gene Rodenberyy in Cleveland a few years ago, and > he concluded by showing The Cage in its entirety. It was actually a bit > disappointing, because I dont believe anything (at least nothing > consequential) was cut when they made "The Menagerie", so there was nothing > new. If you've seen The Menagerie, you've seen The Cage. Incidently the > film I saw was in black and white. At a recent Omnicom convention in Miami, Majel Barrett (sic?) show a copy of "The Cage" which was partially colored by the miracle of modern computer techniques. It kept jumping back and forth from b&w to color. I thought it greatly improved the quality of the tape, but she said they canceled the project because 'they' thought the color was to distracting. She said that the tape she had (Gene's copy) was all that remained from the attempt. She did say that Gene had just signed a deal to make "The cage" (b&w) available on video cassette.
barb@oliven.UUCP (Barbara Jernigan) (03/07/86)
> According to Asimov's "The Hugo Winners," Star Trek won the best > dramatic presentation award in 1968 for "City on the Edge of > Forever." They list Harlan Ellison as the author, although > the decision was based on the Roddenberry script that was aired. Harlan's by-line is on the episode credits.
wheel@utastro.UUCP (Craig Wheeler) (03/08/86)
Of course, all I have seen of the first ST episode are the brief clips supplied in the Menagerie episode. While watching it, my brother picked up that Spock is limping through most of it, with no mention of what happened to his leg. (not sure which leg it was) Does anyone know why he is limping? It is obvious that he is, yet.. -----------------------------------------------
ccrdave@ucdavis.UUCP (Lord Kahless @ Imperial Propoganda) (03/08/86)
> > According to Asimov's "The Hugo Winners," Star Trek won the best > > dramatic presentation award in 1968 for "City on the Edge of > > Forever." They list Harlan Ellison as the author, although > > the decision was based on the Roddenberry script that was aired. > > Harlan's by-line is on the episode credits. But Roddenberry totally rewrote the episode. It was at least as much Roddenberry as Ellison. That's what I meant by the "Roddenberry" script. Ellison won the Screen Writer's Guild award on HIS version, though.
polish@garfield.columbia.edu (Nathaniel Polish) (03/08/86)
Also note that in the first "episode" there is NOTHING behind the bridge turbo-lift door; people just walk off set past the open door. Also everyone's boots clunk around the bridge. Listen to the foot steps sometime. Also, what the h*ll gives with the briefing room in the second pilot? It was a sort of surreal translucent structure inside a bigger room.
ccrdave@ucdavis.UUCP (Lord Kahless @ Imperial Propoganda) (03/08/86)
> Of course, all I have seen of the first ST episode are the brief clips supplied > in the Menagerie episode. > > While watching it, my brother picked up that Spock is limping through most of > it, with no mention of what happened to his leg. (not sure which leg it was) > > Does anyone know why he is limping? It is obvious that he is, yet.. Spock was supposed to have been injured during the fight on Rigel with those big, ugly guys.
dayoung@hplabsc.UUCP (Doug A. Young) (03/10/86)
> > > > I attended a talk by Gene Rodenberyy in Cleveland a few years ago, and > > he concluded by showing The Cage in its entirety. It was actually a bit > > disappointing, because I dont believe anything (at least nothing > > consequential) was cut when they made "The Menagerie", so there was nothing > > new. If you've seen The Menagerie, you've seen The Cage. Incidently the > > film I saw was in black and white. > > > from: dayoung@hplabs Doug Young, HPLABS, Palo Alto > > I also have attended one of GR's talks, and seen the B&W print of The Cage. > I suppose it's the same one he shows most any time he gives a ST talk. But > if you didn't notice any "new" scenes, you missed out, assuming you saw the > same thing I saw. (Or maybe your judgement about what is "consequential" > is different from mine.) The scene that stands out in my mind is a scene > on the Enterprise bridge after the attempt to beam down to the planet, when > the women were transported and the men were left behind. A very excited > (emotional!) Spock decides that it is too dangerous to remain in orbit around > Talos IV, and orders the ship to leave. I vaguely recall that they then lost > power, and so were unable to leave orbit. Then later, when the women beam > back (after the final scene on the planet surface), someone says "Mr. Spock, > systems are coming on." (Or something close to that.) In The Menagerie, > that remark never quite seemed to make sense; this bridge scene puts it into > its proper context. > > H. George Friedman, Jr. > Department of Computer Science > University of Illinois at Urbana-Champaign > 1304 West Springfield Avenue > Urbana, Illinois 61801 > > USENET: ...!{pur-ee,ihnp4,convex}!uiucdcs!friedman > CSNET: friedman%uiuc@csnet-relay.arpa > ARPA: friedman@uiuc.arpa Your memory is better than mine! It's been about 9 years since I saw the Cage. I primarily remember thinking at the time that there was nothing really new. You're undoubtably right about the few added scenes bringing some things into context, unfortunately the same could be said about the complete versions of any of the weekly episodes in syndication after they have been cut up. Does anyone know if the video tapes for sale are complete? Doug dayoung@hplabs
megabyte@chinet.UUCP (Mark E. Sunderlin) (03/13/86)
> >While watching it, my brother picked up that Spock is limping through most of >it, with no mention of what happened to his leg. (not sure which leg it was) > >Does anyone know why he is limping? It is obvious that he is, yet.. According to the James Blish adaptation of this episode, which is taken from the original script, Spock had been hurt in a battle on Rigel just prior to the story. This is the basis for the battle Pike has to re-live with Vina for "The Keeper" -- _________________________________________________________________________ UUCP: (1) seismo!dolqci!irsdcp!scsnet!sunder Mark E. Sunderlin (2) ihnp4!chinet!megabyte aka Dr. Megabyte CIS: 74026,3235 (202) 634-2529 Quote: "No matter where you go, There you are" (9-4 EST) Mail: IRS 1111 Constitution Ave. NW PM:S:D:NO Washington, DC 20224