clewis@eci386.uucp (Chris Lewis) (11/09/89)
This is driving me nuts. I've been trying to understand this crap for years, but I've never been able to get someone who really understands this to either explain it, or tell me *where* I can RTFM. I'm running smail 2.5 and pathalias 9 with the current maps *without* any path file stripping (eg: Peter Honeyman's egrep). On occasion, I've seen references to the ".on.ca" domain float by. So, I try sending mail to "evan@telly.on.ca". These are our path entries: >.telly.on.ca yunexus!utai!yorkvm1.bitnet!%s 195 >telly telly!%s 195 >telly.on.ca yunexus!utai!yorkvm1.bitnet!telly.on.ca!%s 195 (We have a direct connect to telly). H'm, smail 2.5 expands that out to: yunexus!utai!yorkvm1.bitnet!evan Well, it would be nice if it expanded simply to "telly!evan", but it doesn't. Guess we can live with that. I think that "telly!telly.on.ca!evan" would work too, but never mind. Bitnet seems a little silly, but okay. Surely there's a better route from yunexus to yorkvm1.bitnet than by utai, but okay. But, unless Evan has made special arrangements with yorkvm1.bitnet, a userid of "evan" will bounce (and most probably end up in the great bitbucket in the sky). What's the problem? - Should smail be looking for ".telly.on.ca" first? If not, I could fix that easily enough. - Should we be deleting certain patterns from the pathalias output? - Is there something wrong with telly's map entry? - Is there something wrong at York? - Is there something wrong with me? (Naw, don't answer that!) - Is this a question that should never be asked? - Are .ca and .on.ca bogus? From the point of view of the UUCP maps they appear to be simply an exercise in inventing new and non-functional naming. They certainly don't seem to work anywhere as well as the ol' "telly!....". Though, of course from other networks they are pretty important. I thought domains were supposed to make the maps smaller! -- He's a consultant: | Chris Lewis, Elegant Communications Inc. Lend him your watch | UUCP {uunet!attcan,utzoo}!lsuc!eci386!clewis and he'll tell you the time. | Moderator of the Ferret mailing list. Don Munroe, Cosmic Commander|
rayan@cs.toronto.edu (Rayan Zachariassen) (11/10/89)
clewis@eci386.uucp (Chris Lewis) writes: >H'm, smail 2.5 expands that out to: > yunexus!utai!yorkvm1.bitnet!evan This is a bug in smail2.5. I don't have the fix. People run into this bug all the time and few think to blame smail. I don't know why the utai!yorkvm1.bitnet route is being used, it doesn't make sense with the map data I put out, however I will check it for the upcoming issue. > - Are .ca and .on.ca bogus? From the point of view of the UUCP > maps they appear to be simply an exercise in inventing new > and non-functional naming. They certainly don't seem to work > anywhere as well as the ol' "telly!....". Though, > of course from other networks they are pretty important. >I thought domains were supposed to make the maps smaller! They do (for large sites) but for every progress there is regress (in this case, broken software)
dan@maccs.dcss.mcmaster.ca (Dan Trottier) (11/10/89)
In article <89Nov9.144803est.2778@neat.cs.toronto.edu> rayan@cs.toronto.edu (Rayan Zachariassen) writes: >clewis@eci386.uucp (Chris Lewis) writes: > >>H'm, smail 2.5 expands that out to: > >> yunexus!utai!yorkvm1.bitnet!evan > >This is a bug in smail2.5. I don't have the fix. People run into this >bug all the time and few think to blame smail. It is a bug an I have a fix if anyone is interested. The solution is to first check host.sub.domain before checking .host.sub.domain. We've run for about a 8 months with this change and everything seems to work fine. I could post a patch to this group if enough people are interested. -- Dan Trottier dan@maccs.dcss.McMaster.CA Dept of Computer Science ...!uunet!utai!utgpu!maccs!dan McMaster University (416) 525-9140 x3444
bdb@becker.UUCP (Bruce Becker) (11/11/89)
In article <255AD774.21064@maccs.dcss.mcmaster.ca> dan@maccs.dcss.mcmaster.ca (Dan Trottier) writes: |In article <89Nov9.144803est.2778@neat.cs.toronto.edu> rayan@cs.toronto.edu (Rayan Zachariassen) writes: |>clewis@eci386.uucp (Chris Lewis) writes: |> |>>H'm, smail 2.5 expands that out to: |> |>> yunexus!utai!yorkvm1.bitnet!evan |> |>This is a bug in smail2.5. I don't have the fix. People run into this |>bug all the time and few think to blame smail. | |It is a bug an I have a fix if anyone is interested. The solution is to |first check host.sub.domain before checking .host.sub.domain. We've run |for about a 8 months with this change and everything seems to work fine. | |I could post a patch to this group if enough people are interested. Sure, go ahead & post it. If you don't, however, please send me a copy. -- .::. Bruce Becker Toronto, Ont. w \@@/ Internet: bdb@becker.UUCP, bruce@gpu.utcs.toronto.edu `/c/-e BitNet: BECKER@HUMBER.BITNET _/ \_ Your Agrarian Distress Card - Don't heave loam without it...
clewis@ecicrl.UUCP (Chris Lewis) (11/16/89)
In article <89Nov9.144803est.2778@neat.cs.toronto.edu> rayan@cs.toronto.edu (Rayan Zachariassen) writes: >clewis@eci386.uucp (Chris Lewis) writes: >>H'm, smail 2.5 expands that out to: >> yunexus!utai!yorkvm1.bitnet!evan >This is a bug in smail2.5. I don't have the fix. People run into this >bug all the time and few think to blame smail. I sort of figured it was, but I was hoping for a pronouncement from someone who knows as much about it as you do. Thanks Rayan. I'll try out one of the patches and let people know what happens. >> - Are .ca and .on.ca bogus? From the point of view of the UUCP >> maps they appear to be simply an exercise in inventing new >> and non-functional naming. They certainly don't seem to work >> anywhere as well as the ol' "telly!....". Though, >> of course from other networks they are pretty important. Does the fact that you left this in without comment is a comment in itself? ;-) Should I have not commented on the commentless nature of this comment? Never mind. -- Chris Lewis, Elegant Communications Inc. UUCP: {uunet!mnetor, utcsri!utzoo, uunet!attcan!lsuc, yunexus}!ecicrl!clewis Moderator of the Ferret Mailing List (ferret-request@eci386) Phone: (416)-294-9253
lee@sq.sq.com (Liam R. E. Quin) (11/20/89)
In article <735@ecicrl.UUCP> clewis@ecicrl.UUCP (Chris Lewis) writes: >> [Rayan left undeleted:] >>> - Are .ca and .on.ca bogus? From the point of view of the UUCP >>> maps they appear to be simply an exercise in inventing new >>> and non-functional naming. They certainly don't seem to work >>> anywhere as well as the ol' "telly!....". Though, >>> of course from other networks they are pretty important. My [mis-]understanding of North American geography has been throwin into turmoil. Until I visited Canda, I had thought that lots of places I had known only through news and mail were in the States, since they were so clearly marked with CA, the state abbreviation for California. Now I doscover that dome of the Californian places are really in Canada. This is most confusing, as I am fairly sure that Canada and California, whilst lexicographically proximate, are geographically remote. What am I missing? Why is Canada CA and not CAN, and why CAN't CAlifornia be CA? Lee -- Liam R. Quin, Unixsys (UK) Ltd [note: not an employee of "sq" - a visitor!] lee@sq.com (Whilst visiting Canada from England) lee@anduk.co.uk (Upon my return to England at Christmas)
henry@utzoo.uucp (Henry Spencer) (11/20/89)
In article <1989Nov19.202624.15502@sq.sq.com> lee@sq.com (Liam R. E. Quin) writes: >What am I missing? Why is Canada CA and not CAN...? It boils down to "stupidity". The problem is that there is an ISO standard for two-character country codes, and some clot conceived the idea of using codes (intended for use by machines) as names (intended for use by humans) when the issue of naming national domains came up. When the .ca domain first got registered, some of us said this was a stupid idea, and pointed out the Canada/California problem, and were ignored. It's the same mentality that says that you ought to write "891119230823" instead of "Sun Nov 19 18:08:23 EST 1989" because the former is an ISO standard and easier for computers to understand. I'm really very glad that U of T is toronto.edu; everybody knows what *that* means. (It's also utoronto.ca, but so many mailers choke on that that it's simpler to just ignore it.) -- A bit of tolerance is worth a | Henry Spencer at U of Toronto Zoology megabyte of flaming. | uunet!attcan!utzoo!henry henry@zoo.toronto.edu
egisin@mks.com (Eric Gisin) (11/21/89)
In article <1989Nov19.202624.15502@sq.sq.com>, lee@sq.sq.com (Liam R. E. Quin) writes: > What am I missing? Why is Canada CA and not CAN, and why CAN't CAlifornia > be CA? Or why can't Califoria be CL? Canadians aren't confused by CA, Americans are. Why should we change instead of them? Anyone who has been reading news for a while should realise that two character top-level domains are country codes, not states. OZ, UK, FR aren't states, and account for several percent of addresses.
lee@sq.sq.com (Liam R. E. Quin) (11/25/89)
Thanks to all those who pointed out that CA is ISO-speak for Canada. It's about as obvious as using FR would be for Ireland if you ask me, but they didn't. In article <1989Nov21.011916.8115@mks.com> egisin@mks.com (Eric Gisin) writes: >[...] two character top-level domains are country codes, not states. >OZ, UK, FR aren't states, and account for several percent of addresses. Well, we could start having a domain for each county. I am not sure if we should have Y1, Y2 and Y3 for the Yorkshire Ridings, however, and two character abbreviations might be hard. Hmmm. unixsys.co.la (we are in Lancashire) would be great for Californians.... :-) Lee -- Liam R. Quin, Unixsys (UK) Ltd [note: not an employee of "sq" - a visitor!] lee@sq.com (Whilst visiting Canada from England) Unix Wizard -- someone who wears a yellow T-shirt.
andy@mks.com (Andy Toy) (11/26/89)
In article <1989Nov25.083642.6625@sq.sq.com> lee@sq.com (Liam R. E. Quin) writes: > unixsys.co.la (we are in Lancashire) You must mean unixsys.co.la.uk >would be great for Californians.... :-) That would be unixsys.co.la.ca.us :-) -- Andy Toy, Mortice Kern Systems Inc., Internet: andy@mks.com 35 King Street North, Waterloo, UUCP: uunet!watmath!mks!andy Ontario, CANADA N2J 2W9 Phone: 519/884-2251 FAX: 519/884-8861