wickart@iuvax.UUCP (05/10/84)
Surprise! You can get both runners yourself, with very little effort: In the earlier days of baseball, with a runner on third, Ty Cobb delighted in stealing second base from first, and stealing first from second on the following pitch. If any throw was attempted, Cobb would do his best to take out the recipient, allowing the runner to score. This tactic so annoyed the opposition that a rule was passed stating that once a runner had taken legal posession of a base, the only ways this could be relinquished were by putout or advancing to toward the next base. Under this rule, now that Beeblebrox has touched third, it is closed to Andrews until Beeblebrox either is put out or advances to home (the latter is useless, as Beeblebrox would have to pass Andrews to score; passing another runner causes one to be out). Since Beeblebrox owns third, he is not safe anywhere but there and home, and Andrews is safe only at home. Simply chase Andrews toward home, and Andrews is safe only at home. Simply chase Andrews toward third. As he cannot stray more than 3 feet from the basepath between third and home, he will be an easy out. He cannot back up farther than third, as the third-home path is his only refuge. Now chase Beeblebrox towrd second in exactly the same fashion. As his only refuge is likewise the third-home basepath, as soon as he makes any move away from you, he is out for leaving the path to avoid putout. On the offensive side, once Beeblebrox realizes that you are rather nonchalant about all this, he should probably make a beeline to round third and head for home. Granted, he will be out as soon as he passes Andrews, but it will allow Andrews to retake third, and may confuse enough of your teammates (and possibly you) to allow Andrews to score. In any case, it can cut his tem's loss to one baserunner. Note: when this happened to me, the umpire was not aware of the rules, calling Andrews safe at third, Beeblebrox safe at second. At my behest, the team captain registered a protest of the game (we were behind by two runs at the time). I was required to finish pitching the inning from there (pitcher is backup at the plate on these plays), with Andrews eventually scoring. We won the game anyway, but, as my ERA had been besmirched, the protest was continued. The umpire was overruled by the league comission, and the final score adjusted by that one run.
halle1@houxz.UUCP (J.HALLE) (05/10/84)
You better get a new league comish. The ump was right. Merely touching the base does not mean you own the base. Until the runner in front of you legally advances to the next base, he owns that base, so you cannot own it also. As an example, in the famous Babe Herman incident, three runners ended up on third. Only the first one was legally there. The other two could legally go back to second and first. Of course they might be tagged out on the way, and could have been tagged while on third (and were). In your example, the front runner could legally go back to third. If he did, the back runner could legally go back to second, as that was the last base he "owned." If the front runner were tagged out, then third is the back guy's. This situation is described in detail in the rulebook. I am surprised your protest was upheld. Obviously it was through your lambasting and not through careful reading.
mp@ganehd.UUCP (Scott Barman @ Univ. of Ga.) (05/13/84)
< Bugs like these keeps us systems programmers employed >
I have really seen this on:
Runners on second and third, one out, and a heavy hitter up. On a high,
hanging curve ball, the batter flies to the warning track in Center Field.
The runner on second didn't tag-up and on his way back, he is thrown out by
the center fielder (Three outs). My major league rules, an inning cannot be
over until all play is stopped, except on a ball that was just hit. A play
on the hit ball causing a third out (like a ground out) automatically ends
the inning. However, because the ball was caught, thrown to second to get
the runner, if the runner on third tags up and goes, then the play cannot
be stopped.
In the game I saw, this happened. The catch made 2 outs. Getting the runner
on second was three. But because the runner on third tagged and was going
home, the play wasn't dead. I saw the runner thrown out at the plate
(out #4). This happened in 1980 during a Braves v. Mets game in Atlanta.
(By the way, it was the Mets who were the victims of this - Joe Torre
argued the play - he was still with the Mets, and got ejected. He's
still the same idiot :->).
LET'S GO METS
Still hating Braves Fans in Athens, Ga,
Scott Barman
..!{akgua, gatech}!ganehd!mp