vernick@tesla.UUCP (Michael Vernick) (07/18/84)
A little trivia here. On Friday the 13th of July, every Eastern division team (13 of them) in both leagues won!! Does anyone know if that is a common occurence? Also, to the guy who thinks Gooden cannot rely on his fastball and would turn into another Nolan Ryan. What is wrong with that? Ryan is an all-time great, a definite Hall of Famer. I particular like to watch fireballers come right at hitters, like Gossage, Ryan, and J.R. Richard when he was able to throw. I think its more of a challenge to hitters. One other thing, Ryan and Carlton have approx. the same number of K's, but isn't it true that Ryan has pitched ~1000 less innings than Carlton? Mike Vernick cornell!tesla!vernick
gregbo@hou2e.UUCP (Greg Skinner) (07/20/84)
> From: vernick@tesla.UUCP (Michael Vernick) > Also, to the guy who thinks Gooden cannot rely on his fastball and would > turn into another Nolan Ryan. What is wrong with that? Ryan is an all-time > great, a definite Hall of Famer. I particular like to watch fireballers > come right at hitters, like Gossage, Ryan, and J.R. Richard when he was able > to throw. I think its more of a challenge to hitters. One other thing, > Ryan and Carlton have approx. the same number of K's, but isn't it > true that Ryan has pitched ~1000 less innings than Carlton? I'm the guy who posted it. What's wrong with that is that Dwight Gooden is in the major leagues now, and he has got to learn that he can't simply blow a fastball by batters for seven, eight, nine innings every outing and not expect to get shellacked. For one, the National League has a lower strike zone, so a lot of his high fastballs will be called "balls" in the National League. Nolan Ryan was an awful pitcher for the Mets, not primarily because the Mets were unable to give him runs but he was very wild -- walked quite a lot of batters and lost more games than he won. In 1973 (I think) the year he was traded to California, he was a 20-game winner and struck out the famous 383 batters. Now, he's back in the NL and isn't winning 20 games, neither is his ERA particularly good. Secondly, Dwight Gooden has had control trouble in his last couple of starts. He has not pitched a complete game lately. He lost his last decision after giving up 6 walks. Most of the time, the batters were laying off his high fastball. Only those trying to hit the ball out of the park would swing at it. Ralph Kiner and Tim McCarver made a good comment one night on the difference between a talented pitcher and a pitcher who has potential. A pitcher who can strike men out (like Gooden) has potential. However, it takes a pitcher with an assortment of pitches, or at least two good pitches, to be talented. [The following should be construed as my opinion.] A talented pitcher should have a good fast ball, curve and change-of-pace. Look at your current talented pitchers -- Valenzuela, Stieb. They don't have to throw the fastball to get men out always. I haven't seen any evidence that Gooden can get men out without striking them out -- his control of late has not indicated to me that he can go to the curve, or an off-speed pitch, when he loses control of his fastball. And in the middle of the season, in the late innings, when you've been throwing at > 90 mph, you're bound to get tired and start walking batters. That's what Gooden has been doing of late. I'm a Mets fan, but I feel I must speak out on the subject of Gooden, because in the late season the Mets will be expecting a lot from him -- to be able to win close ballgames when the Mets batters are stifled against an opposing ace starter. If he doesn't develop some better control, he won't be able to deliver those wins in tight situations. And that will be bad news for the Mets.
kaufman@uiucdcs.UUCP (07/21/84)
#R:tesla:-40200:uiucdcs:12900019:000:107 uiucdcs!kaufman Jul 21 10:47:00 1984 And when you throw in the fact that there were two twi-nighters, the East went 15 for 15 against the West!
petec@umcp-cs.UUCP (07/25/84)
I don't want to get involved in the comparison between Gooden and Ryan, because I live and root in an American League area, and haven't seen Gooden enough (although the All-Star game was quite an introduction). But I will say some things in defense of Ryan. >>Nolan Ryan was an awful pitcher >>for the Mets, not primarily because the Mets were unable to give him runs but >>he was very wild -- walked quite a lot of batters and lost more games than he >>won. In 1973 (I think) the year he was traded to California, he was a 20-game >>winner and struck out the famous 383 batters. Now, he's back in the NL and >>isn't winning 20 games, neither is his ERA particularly good. Ryan really wasn't so good in his early years with the Mets, but I think part of that is a youngster facing major league hitting and learning the difference between being a thrower and being a pitcher. He isn't winning 20 games, but he has had 3 of his best 4 years for winning percentage (excluding 6-3, .667 record in 1969 as a part-timer) in his 4 years in Houston, and I would take his Houston ERAs of 3.35, 1.69, 3.16, and 2.98 any day. That comes to about a 2.91 average, which is below his career average of 3.10 . Also, Ryan hasn't had to win 20 games; the Astros have often had other talented pitchers, and it wasn't necessary to have Ryan pitch 300+ innings a year. -- Call-Me: Pete Cottrell, Univ. of Md. Comp. Sci. Dept. UUCP: {seismo,allegra,brl-bmd}!umcp-cs!petec CSNet: petec@umcp-cs ARPA: petec@maryland