evan@petfe.UUCP (Evan Marcus) (04/19/85)
I would like (eagerly) to be included in the Dump the DH club, if
anyone has any information. I believe that the the DH is an
abomination against baseball.
--Evan Marcus
--
--Evan Marcus
{ucbvax|decvax}|vax135|petsd|pedsgd|pedsga|evan
There are two kinds of people in the world, those who divide people into two
kinds, and those who don't.iskowitz@aecom.UUCP (Dov Iskowitz) (04/24/85)
> I would like (eagerly) to be included in the Dump the DH club, if > anyone has any information. I believe that the the DH is an > abomination against baseball. > > --Evan Marcus > -- > > > --Evan Marcus > {ucbvax|decvax}|vax135|petsd|pedsgd|pedsga|evan > > There are two kinds of people in the world, those who divide people into two > kinds, and those who don't. *** REPLACE THIS LINE WITH YOUR MESSAGE *** An interesing t-question. Who was the NL's first DH?
man@bocar.UUCP (M Nevar) (04/26/85)
< An interesting t-question. Who was the NL's first DH? My guess would be Dan Driessen (sp?) who DH'd for the Reds in the '76 series.
johnp@ihuxf.UUCP (John Schleicher) (05/03/85)
>> Roy writes: > >>> Dump th DH??? >>> >>> Why, because the sacrifice bunt is the most exciting play in baseball??? > > >> A sacrifice bunt requires a choice, and its excitement is strategic. >> Also, a sacrifice bunt by a pitcher is no less exciting than a >> sacrifice bunt by a shortstop...would you have us ban sacrifice bunts? >> If fewer sacrifice bunts is a positive good, from your point of view, >> wouldn't even fewer be better? > >> David "The DH is an Abomination" Rubin >> > > I have an even better idea. Why not put in a rule that pitchers >can only throw straight pitches traveling at a speed of no greater than >50 mph. Boy would there be a lot of "exciting" home runs then !!! :-) > > Seriously, though. Football and basketball have been hurt by trying >to spice up the offense. Let's not allow baseball to move in that direction. > > Dave Van Handel I don't know what it is about all of you vocal "dump the DH" fans out there but given the choice I would prefer to watch an American league game over a national league game (any team) any day of the week. It is simply a better contest having 9 batters who bat on a daily basis. I too am not fond I watching a pitcher sacrifice bunt or strike out. What does it add to the game? As far as the comment of not allowing baseball to move in the direction of trying to spice up the offense, what of the lowering of the pitcher's mound (was it the late sixties) in both leagues to aid the offense. I don't feel that that was a mistake, do you Dave? John Schleicher ihuxf!johnp
david@fisher.UUCP (David Rubin) (05/05/85)
>I don't know what it is about all of you vocal "dump the DH" fans out there >but given the choice I would prefer to watch an American league game over a >national league game (any team) any day of the week. It is simply a better >contest having 9 batters who bat on a daily basis. I too am not fond I >watching a pitcher sacrifice bunt or strike out. What does it add to the game? Tsk, tsk. DH-proponents ask the wrong question. The proper question is "what does the DH add to the game?"; the burden of proof rests upon the proponents of change. Moreover, all responses to my anti-DHism ignore my most salient points, probably because they are not answerable: (1) Why are we so hung up on the pitcher? What of other weak hitters? (2) How much free substitution is enough? Too much? (3) Does the extra hit (that's the average offensive difference between an AL game and an NL game) provide so much of a thrill that it warrants radical surgery on the game? Are all thrills offensive? Are no thrills strategic? (4) Anti-DH'ers list all sorts of reason for opposition: tradition, ineffectiveness of the DH, horror at free substitution, repulsion at players permitted to remain in a game without being called upon to display more than one skill, distortion of careers and player evaluations, etc. Pro-Dh'ers have only one reason: offense gives 'em a rush. Where do you pro-DH'ers draw the line, and why? Summary: why limit the logic favoring the DH to one position? If the logic is flawed, ban the DH; if the logic is true, expand it to more (even nine) positions. If you don't like the idea of separate offensive and defensive units, you are not yet at peace with the logic of the DH. > As far as the comment of not allowing baseball to move in the direction of > trying to spice up the offense, what of the lowering of the pitcher's mound > (was it the late sixties) in both leagues to aid the offense. I don't feel > that that was a mistake, do you Dave? Lowering the mound is of the same order of magnitude as switching from a "live" ball to a "dead" ball or requiring some uniformity of fence distances or adjusting the batter's box: rules which change the balance of the game without changing the game itself. The DH, on the other hand, represents radical surgery. If you pro-DH'ers are indifferent as to whether changes are textual or contextual, why not make us obstinate purists happier by lowering the mound again, if it's offense you want, and banning the DH? At least then NL and AL baseball would be the same game under similar circumstances rather than similar games under the same circumstances. David Rubin {allegra|astrovax|princeton}!fisher!david
pete@umcp-cs.UUCP (Pete Cottrell) (05/07/85)
> >Tsk, tsk. DH-proponents ask the wrong question. The proper question >is "what does the DH add to the game?"; the burden of proof rests upon >the proponents of change. Moreover, all responses to my anti-DHism >ignore my most salient points, probably because they are not >answerable: > > <salient points> ...... > Well, as the proponents say, it lets aging hitters stick around and does create a bit more hitting and excitement than having a pitcher always hit, so I like it for this. BUT: the cost in terms of the strategy game (when to pinch-hit for a pitcher, which pitcher to bring in knowing that he will probably be pinch-hit for in the next inning, etc) is too great, and it is too radical a change to the way baseball has always been played, so... I would have to vote to get rid of it for purity's sake. Too bad that what I consider one of the other great problems in baseball can't be voted out: artificial turf. I hate the stuff; it is an abomination. As surely as as the pitcher was meant to hit, baseball was meant to be played on grass. Some AL teams have artificial turf, but the NL is the big offender here. It's getting to the point where I hate to see those giant symmetric plastic ballparks (but somehow I can't turn off the tube; I'm hooked ). And don't get me started on domed stadiums... Ahhh. A pitcher batting in the sun on a grass field, one of baseball's greatest sights!!! ;-) -- Call-Me: Pete Cottrell, Univ. of Md. Comp. Sci. Dept. UUCP: {seismo,allegra,brl-bmd}!umcp-cs!pete CSNet: pete@umcp-cs ARPA: pete@maryland
priebe@noscvax.UUCP (Carey E. Priebe) (05/09/85)
I am now, and have always been, an American Leaguer. I have been a loyal Tigers fan since I can remember (about '67). I wish they could have DH-ed for Eddie Brinkman ":-)". However, this doesn't mean I am pro-DH. If we are going to honestly discuss the merits of the DH we should leave petty League-slurs out of it. The fact is, to many of us the sacrifice bunt, pinch-hit, bench jockeying, multiple relievers, etc, are stimulating and add more to the game than an aging slugger. It would have been nice, I suppose, to have had Al Kaline DH-ing until his 50th birthday, but I don't think it would replace the mind games Sparkey Anderson used to play in Cincy. Therefore, this die-hard AL-er casts his vote for exciting, cerebral baseball. Carey Priebe ***Whitaker & Trammell leave nothing to be desired***
wetcw@pyuxa.UUCP (T C Wheeler) (05/09/85)
R eferences: <2597@ihuxf.UUCP> <607@fisher.UUCP>, <5515@umcp-cs.UUCP> Gee, how old does a pinch hitter have to be before he is considered as an aging pinch hitter? Rusty Staub is certainly no spring chicken yet he brings the crowd to its feet every time he walks out to the circle. As a DH, I doubt that this reaction would result when he walked out 3 or 4 times a game. T. C. Wheeler
pannell@dosadi.DEC (Roger D. Pannell 229-6893 LTN1-1/D03) (05/18/85)
Being a long time Braves fan, I prefer to have baseball played without the DH.
In fact, until recently I would have said "Dump the DH", but after suffering
while watching the Braves this past week (2 runs in 62 innings) I would like
to see the DH expanded to include all nine positions, at least for the
Braves. :-)
-- Roger Pannell
ARPA: pannell%dosadi.DEC@DECWRL.ARPA, pannell%dosadi.DEC@Purdue-Merlin.ARPA
UUCP: {allegra, decvax, ucbvax}!decwrl!rhea!dosadi!pannell