jho@ihuxn.UUCP (Yosi Hoshen) (04/26/84)
Bill Mitchell complained about the sound quality on Denon's LP featuring Jean-Pierre Rampal. (Please post the catalog number of this record, or other info so that the rest of us will not get a rotten egg). I have not listened to this record, but your conclusions do not surprise me. As you recall, my excitement was mostly restricted to Smetana Quartet performance of Beethoven and Mozart String Chamber music. I have been a classical music fanatic since the age of 11, yet, Beethoven's Late string quartets were inaccessible to me. They were just too difficult for me to appreciate. The new Denon Smetana performances of these quartets, really opened my eyes (ears). I now thoroughly enjoy these masterworks. I can only attribute my rediscovery of this great music to the superb performance of the Smetana Ensemble with the clarity of the new CD medium. Let me point out two Denon CDs which I think are pleasant, but definitely not great. These are Mozart clarinet quintet (catalog # C37-7038) and Mozart's Oboe quartet and quintet (C37-7034). In both recording the woodwind instrument is too closely microphoned, thus, creating imbalance between the strings and the woodwind. Also, the Philarmonia Quartet Berlin, the performer on these CDs, is not of the same caliber as the Smetana Quartet. Telarc which can be described as the leader in digital recording, I think has at least one bad apple, namely, the CD 80040 Malcom Frager Plays Chopain. I feel this CD is sonically deficiant. It seems to me that they made two mistakes. (1) close microphoning, (2) using the Bosendorfer Imperial Grand Piano. I feel that the Bosendorfer is inappropriate. Its base notes are too strong, obscuring the musical quality of the piece. I would prefer the Steinway for piano digital recordings. (An example of a good piano sound on a CD is Gilels plays Beethoven's Moonlight and other sonatas on DGG.) Bill implied that Nonesuch is Using the Soundstream system. Are you sure? I have a Nonesuch CD carrying Schubert's Octet. The information with the CD specifies that they are using the JVC Digital System. I like the performance on this CD, by the Boston Symphony Chamber Players. The sound on this CD is another story. There is no clarity in the individual sound of the instruments. It seems to me that the microphones are at fault on this recording. RCA seems to be using the Soundstream system, and with good results. I have their Handel's Messiah which has a very good sound and performance. Bill says: >Denon uses a lower sampling rate (44.1 KHz) >for their master tapes than do those companies (like Telarc) that use >the Soundstream system (50 KHz) and this might make a difference. The sampling rates on all CDs are 44.1 KHz. Telarc, which uses 50 KHz, has to reduce their data rate to 44.1 KHz. I assume they are using some kind of numerical interpolating scheme (linear or cubic, I presume). Let us get into some technical details concerning the Denon digital recordings. I have a Denon catalog describing their digital system. Denon made their first digital recording in 1972. However, only in 1974 they have issued significant number of digital LPs. They used their DN-023R recording system. In 1977 Denon introduced their DN-034R digital recording system. They don't give technical info on both systems, but I suspect that these are 14 bit systems (correct me if I am wrong). Let me point out that that some of my Beethoven String Quartet recording are dated 1976, 1977 and 1978. They must have been using the above systems with great results. In 1979 Denon came with their DN-035R, a 4 channel system using 16 bit encoding. Their is a lot of technical info on this system. The sampling rate is 47.25 (It can also use sampling rate of 48 and 44.1). They use 4 channel recording for classical music. Their mixing editing etc. all the way to the production of a CD is digital (the same philosophy as Telarc). For non-classical music they do 32 channel pcm recording. The mixing of the 32 channels is analog. A final note. Listening to music is very subjective. Yet, I feel that any information we provide to each other is valuable, as CDs are expensive. If any one has information on disc quality, sound, performance, etc., please post or send mail. -- Yosi Hoshen Bell Laboratories Naperville, Illinois (312)-979-7321 Mail: ihnp4!ihuxn!jho
wjm@whuxj.UUCP (MITCHELL) (04/27/84)
In reply to Yosi Hoshen's question, I believe the catalog number of the Denon Rampal recording I disliked is OX-7027-ND (as I mentioned earlier, this is the LP version - I don't know the CD catalog number (but I suspect the 7027 suffix will remain in it) Yes, record companies using the Soundstream system (with its 50 KHz sampling rate) have to reduce the data rate to 44.1 KHz for CD's and digital processing techniques are used here. This would not be a factor in my comparisons, since I've been using LP versions of all the recordings for this purpose. Again, this may be a matter of taste, but I have not found the Telarc Malcolm Frager Plays Chopin recording (LP version DG-10040) that objectionable. I will agree that the Bosendorfer is a bit overpowering for most of the piano repetroire, especially the Beethoven sonatas, and agree that a Steinway is much more appropriate (there are some new Alfred Brendel recordings on Phillips that are excellent - they are digitally mastered but I don't know if they've been released on CD yet). However, I prefer the power on some of the "larger" Chopin works on this recording. Sorry for the confusion, I did not intend to imply that all the record companies I listed (including Nonesuch) used the Soundstream system - Nonesuch does use a JVC system - just that I found their digital recordings preferable to Denon's. Telarc and Delos use the Soundstream system, I am not sure which system some of the others use - I think London may use Soundstream but I cannot say for sure about the other PolyGram labels. I was also disappointed in the Nonesuch Boston Symphony Chamber Players Schubert Octet recording (LP version) for the same reason. I'm not sure whether net.audio or net.records is a better place to post bouquets and/or brickbats about specific recordings although I think comments about record companies in general and CD's LP's or tapes in general belong on net.audio - you can, of course, post to both. Unfortunately, CBS's so called "audiophile" digital LP's are no better than their other LP's and are noisy, often warped, and subjected to the usual CBS multi-mike treatment which resorts in very unclear sound. I would suspect that CD's could solve the noise and warp problems, but won't fix their sonic problems - I try not to buy CBS recordings, but when an artist I like has an exclusive contract with them, what can one do? Bill Mitchell Bell Communications Research, Inc. Whippany, NJ (whuxj!wjm)
grw@inmet.UUCP (05/01/84)
#R:ihuxn:-63700:inmet:2600070:000:498 inmet!grw Apr 30 14:05:00 1984 I'd like to second wjm's remark about CBS Records' quality control. I recently went through 5 (count 'em) copies of their recent release of La Mer (Master- works Digital) before I found a listenable copy. The listenable copy still has some mildly objectionalable pops in one place but I was to disgusted by then to care. It'll be a while before I patronize them again. -- Gary Wasserman ...harpo!inmet!grw ...hplabs!sri-unix!cca!ima!inmet!grw ...yale-comix!ima!inmet!grw