Human-Nets-Request%rutgers@brl-bmd.UUCP (Human-Nets-Request@rutgers) (10/22/83)
HUMAN-NETS Digest Friday, 21 Oct 1983 Volume 6 : Issue 64
Today's Topics:
Queries: File Privacy &
Is that REALLY how they caught the 414's?
Computers and People - The FBI vs. Hackers &
Computer Conferencing &
Trendiness enhanced by Worldnet?,
Information - MCI Mail System &
"Hacker" victim of Newspeak &
"... Billyuns and Billyuns...",
Computers on TV - Whiz Kids
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Date: Wed, 12 Oct 83 7:27:17 EDT
From: Mike Muuss <mike@brl-vgr>
Subject: [Larry Layten (D: File Privacy]
Date: Wed, 12 Oct 83 6:34:41 EDT
From: Larry Layten (DARCOM) <llayten@BRL>
To: msggroup@BRL, info-law@Sri-Csl
Subject: File Privacy
I am sending this message to this group as an individual interested in
the future uses of electronic mail and computer usage in workplace
automation. My comments and perceptions should not be construed to be
those of the agency for which I work.
BACKGROUND:
I work for the Army Material Development and Readiness Command
(DARCOM) which has been quite active in the use of electronic mail and
in the use of computers in the office environment. The command has
well over three thousand users with access to the DDN. Within our
command headquarters, there are currently over 500 users of our
internal workplace automation computers. The use of the computer
support includes standard text processing support as well as
electronic mail and other office support functions.
PROBLEM:
There have been several (three that I know of) instances where the
Army Criminal Investigation Division (CID), sometimes in conjunction
with the FBI, has obtained complete dumps of our workplace automation
computers without any type of court order or identification of what
they are looking for other than "wrongful use of government property".
They do not limit their dumps to specific files or individuals. They
have read individuals their rights and otherwise tried to intimidate
them in two instances that I know of, once after finding a recipe in a
message, an once, when a baby sitter's phone number was found in a
telephone number file.
Our commands legal staff has advised our managers that what is taking
place is legal, by all precedents. They say that computer files do
not have the same privacy protections that telephone usage has.
We are now seeing some people that used to use the system for at least
receiving electronic mail, request that their accounts be removed
because they do not want to leave themselves open to criticism.
If in fact, the owner of a computer system has the right to search (in
a witch-hunt fashion) through all files, with the threat of
prosecution, then I too will refain from using the system as I have in
the past: as a note pad, telephone replacement, sounding board for
ideas, etc.
I should mention, that there has not yet been any official charges
filed in conjunction with any of the file searches.
Does anyone out there know where the law is heading in this type of
issue? I would hope that 1984 is not as close as it appears.
Larry
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Date: 19 October 1983 23:31 edt
From: TMPLee.DODCSC at MIT-MULTICS
Subject: Query: Is that REALLY how they caught the 414's?
While browsing through the newstand I ran across an article somewhere
dealing with the WarGames and Milwaukee 414's issues. (can it really
happen? sort of thing.) Can't remember exactly where it was, but
somewhere in the article was the claim that the Milwaukee gang was
caught by something right out of a movie. Apparently one of the
places they got into was the Security Pacific Bank (of prior infamy).
Their presence was detected. The clever folks -- possibly with FBI
advice -- put up an attractive version of the Adventure game variety.
Sure enough the kids stumbled across the game and got entranced enough
to start playing it. They were hooked long enough that a trace of the
call could be successfully made.
Does anyone know whether that is really what happened? (I don't want
pointers to the article; it wasn't otherwise memorable enough that I
want to track it down again.)
Ted
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Date: 14 Oct 1983 1525-PDT
From: SEGELBAUM.UCI-20A@Rand-Relay
Subject: FBI vs. Hackers
Disgusting...simply disgusting, that our tax money can be used to turn
FBI thugs (behaving more as we would expect from the KGB or would have
expected from the SS than like professional American law-enforcement
people) loose against high-school kids, when it is a matter for the
airiest of speculation whether anything illegal, or even immoral, was
happening.
Even at the very worst, assuming the kids WERE up to no good, the
crude break-in tactics and the confiscation of property constitute an
over- reaction vastly disproportionate to the alleged infringement,
and are indicative of a sensationalism and hysteria in ignorant
officialdom which must not be tolerated in a "free" and democratic
society.
I have, consequently, notified GTE-Telenet that I am terminating all
use of their products and services, and will recommend against use of
those products and services, and the products and services of any
company which I can ascertain turns to the use of violence -- official
or otherwise -- as a way of dealing with its security problems.
Although I am sure many of you will disagree with me, I also feel sure
almost no one will disagree that there is no prayer of convicting any
of these kids of anything in a court of law (and, indeed, no charges
have to this date been filed); and, therefore, we have here a case of
thuggery, pure and simple. We should not tolerate it.
>From those of you who do disagree with me, I would like to hear your
reasons; also more reasons from people who agree with me.
/Rob
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Date: Fri 14 Oct 83 16:10:07-EDT
From: Janet F. Asteroff <US.JFA@CU20B>
Subject: Computer Conferencing
A couple of corrections and observations on computer conferencing.
Vallee, when he was the the Institute for the Future, wrote PLANET and
Forum, 2 cc systems, one of which is marketed by Infomedia now.
Infomedia's main product is NOTEPAD, also written by Vallee, but
I can't remember if he did that at IFTF.
Hubert Lipinski, who worked on some of those systems, wrote HUB,
which is marketed by IFTF.
Confer and Confer II were written by Bob Parnes at U of Michigan, and
the latter is now marketed by his company in Ann Arbor, Advertel. The
former was his doctoral dissertation. Confer, EIES, and
Notepad are used by corporate and research types.
You are right that the kind of Bulletin Board that H-Nets appears
on is better suited to this kind of communication--an exchange
of information among people who do not know each other. I think
the main use of cc systems is that they be applied basically
among people who know each other, and who have a specific task
or problem to solve. They can be used for ongoing discussions,
but work best in a finite situation.
------------------------------
Date: 15 October 1983 05:57 EDT
From: Robert Elton Maas <REM @ MIT-MC>
Subject: Trendiness enhanced by Worldnet? - unwanted mailing lists
Good question, and I have some answers.
For current Snail Mail, I suggest after you've decided you don't want
a particular group sending you stuff, you put them on your personal
black list. The first time (after or at your decision to blacklist
them) you receive a prepaid envelop from them, write them a nasty note
insisting they remove you from their mailing list and saying you'll
contact postal inspectors if they continue to harass you. All
non-prepaid envelops of course just discard. Subsequent prepaid
envelops, stuff with rotten banana peels or potato peels etc. since
these tend to rot and smell bad really fast, and mail back with your
return address label so they who really wants to be removed. Just sort
of have fun hassling them back worse than they hassle you, until they
give up and remove you from their list.
With electronic mail it's easier. You refuse to accept any mail from
companies on your black list. You program your computer to answer NO I
WON'T to any PLEASE DO ACCEPT MAIL FROM <BLACKLISTED COMPANY>. If you
are getting mail on a non-personal system where you have no way to
filter incoming mail as it arrives, then have your user interface
delete it from your mail archive as you start to read your mail each
time. Right now with existing mail-reading systems (RMAIL, MSG,
BABYL,...) even this is a bit hard, but as soon as the need arises
the mail-reading systems will be modified to have filtering
capability.
So I think electronic mail in WorldNet will make it easer to avoid
junk mail.
------------------------------
Date: 13 Oct 1983 1731-PDT
Subject: MCI Mail
From: Ian H. Merritt <MERRITT@USC-ISIB.ARPA>
I just completed the initiation dialog to the MCI mail service. It is
an interesting dialog, in which the system asks questions such as your
social security number, and mother's maiden name, for identification,
and allows you to specify your own unique ID code if you don't like
the one the system generates from your name. After this, a series of
survey questions are asked, hoping the user will provide answers. For
each question, a simple <CR> indicates you don't wish to answer; and
one may quit the survey at any time without disturbing the service
application previously entered.
To the best of my knowledge, there is no cost to establishing yourself
as a user; only when you actually send something. I think you can set
up a recipient address on-line, also without charge.
I can't tell what kind of hardware the system was that did the
querying, but backspace is character delete, Ctrl/U works for delete
line, after logging in, and Ctrl/R works as a retype. Other control
characters are taken as a delimiter, and RUB characters are ignored.
This leads me to believe that the application is running under VMS.
If anybody is interested in playing with this thing or establishing
their own account, the number is 800-323-7751. (100-300baud/1200baud)
Supply REGISTER for the user ID and REGISTER for password.
<>IHM<>
------------------------------
Date: 15 October 1983 05:40 EDT
From: Robert Elton Maas <REM @ MIT-MC>
Subject: "Hacker" victim of Newspeak !!
According to a story on our local CBS-affiliated station (KPIX 5 in
SF), the word "hacker" means, in computer terminology, "someone who
illegally breaks into computer systems". This is a serious
mis-definition which somebody ought to castigate them for. The only
place the word means that is on a certain new TV show, and even there
it also means somebody who is a wizard at computers, with the illegal
breakins being a side effect of wizardry rather than the central
definition. Perhaps Lauren or Minsky or some other person with media
contacts could mention this to CBS? The original message doesn't seem
to have gotten thru to them from Lauren's interview last month on a
related subject (correct me if I'm mistaken).
------------------------------
Date: 7-Oct-83 17:53 PDT
From: William Daul - Tymshare Inc. Cupertino CA <WBD.TYM@OFFICE-2>
Subject: HOW MUCH IS A BILLION?
According to a recent government publication ...
A billion seconds ago Harry Truman was president.
A billion minutes ago was just after the time of Christ.
A billion hours ago man had not yet walked on earth.
A billion dollars ago was late yesterday at the U.S. Treasury.
------------------------------
Date: 15 October 1983 06:17 EDT
From: Robert Elton Maas <REM @ MIT-MC>
Subject: Whiz Kids, episode #2
These kids are told about a new electronic game by somebody they met
over the net and have never met in person. In fact they have no idea
where this game-programmer is physically located. (Gee, sounds exactly
like Arpanet, I've never met most of you Human-Nets people in person,
and many people don't realize I'm 3000 miles from MIT.) This computer
game is a simulation of an escape from prison. The players (the kids)
are playing against the computer, trying to find a way to escape while
the computer tries to keep them in. Turns out, however, the
game-programmer is really a criminal IN PRISON, and the program is a
realistic simulation, and when the kids finally figure out how to
escape the criminal uses their plan to REALLY ESCAPE.
The rest is the usual cops and robbers stuff, with a
computer-controlled laser room in an amusement park being used by the
kids to scare the really bad guys (not the escapee, some even worse
guys) until the police can arrive.
This kind of thing makes me really think. How do you know those
electronic war games you play at the arcade or on COMPUSERVE aren't
really a simulation of a real war situation, and your playing them is
feeding ideas back to military people to use in a real war?? How do
you know Dungeons and Dragons isn't being used for a prison escape or
some theft or war or whatever? I think home video games are safe for a
while, because they aren't on any network and are never taken back to
the store for repair where data could clandistinely be read out and
fed into the company database, huh?
I think there's a lot of potential for offering a "realistic game",
having the nieve player work really hard at getting a good "score",
and having the game really be a way of getting free consulting from
lots of game players (it's even better than free, the players PAY for
the priviledge of giving free consulting). Perhaps World War 3 will be
run not by generals but by a computer hooked up to millions of
teenagers who think they're just playing a game? Among all the
millions of wonderful strategies thought up by the teenagers, the ones
that get the best score, i.e. the ones that can beat the simulated
USSR, are actually used.
(Gee, I hope my suggestion doesn't get the DOD people on this mailing
list thinking of actually using my generalization of the Whiz Kids
idea!) (Or are they already doing that, and the plot of Whiz Kids was
a carefully controlled "leak" to test the reaction of the "American"
people to disclosure of this fact?)
(Am I getting paranoid??)
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End of HUMAN-NETS Digest
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