Human-Nets-Request%rutgers@brl-bmd.UUCP (Human-Nets-Request@rutgers) (02/16/84)
HUMAN-NETS Digest Thursday, 16 Feb 1984 Volume 7 : Issue 20
Today's Topics:
Response to Query - The "world" of CS,
Computers and the Media - "The Computer for the Rest of Us" &
"Wargames",
Computers and the Law - Person numbers (4 msgs) &
Database Information Notification,
Computers and People - "Big Computer" and Students,
Information - Computer Security Congress
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Date: Monday, 13 Feb 1984 18:37:35-PST
From: decwrl!rhea!glivet!zurko@Shasta
Subject: Re: The "world" of CS
The best place for you to start would be with Sheri Turkle, a
professor at MIT's STS department. She's been studying both the
official and unofficial members of the computer science world as a
culture/society for a few years now. In fact, she's supposed to be
putting a book out on her findings, "The Intimate Machine". Anyone
heard what's up with it? I thought it was supposed to be out last
Sept, but I haven't been able to find it.
Mez
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Date: 14 February 1984 09:51 cst
From: RSaunders.TCSC at HI-MULTICS
Subject: No documentation is a feature???
I have just seen the most interesting commercial on the TV. I feel it
is for the new Macintosh but the story line goes Look at this IBM pc
and its 200 pages of instructions, Look at this cute new Macintosh
with its 30 pages of documentation, Which is more advanced. Is this
an IBM comercial in disguise?? It presents an interesting concept,
that a computer can get by with 30 pages of documentation, but I
wonder who the pitch is aimed at. We in the computer business could
learn to work the Macintosh from 30 pages, because of experience with
similar systems, but would never buy a system that did not have the
background information to tell us HOW it works. John Q. Public
couldn't care how it works, but having nowhere to turn but his Apple
dealer when he is confused doesn't sound like something I would be
advertizing. Maybe Apple feels that people are so stupid that they
will shell out $2500 (or whatever it costs) for a machine that does 30
pages of tricks, but I doubt it (but I could be wrong). Anybody else
seen this? What impression do you think it was putting accross? BTW
I thought the 1984 comercial was cute but certainly did not motivate
me to buy anything but Olympic T-shirts. Is this part of some Apple
master plan where the sales pitch comes 4 months from now?
Interesting!
Randy Saunders
RSaunders @ HI-Multics
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Date: Wed 15 Feb 84 01:19:41-PST
From: Mark Crispin <MRC@SU-SCORE.ARPA>
Subject: "Wargames"
I just saw "Wargames" for the first time. I wish to alter the
low opinion I had of the flick prior to seeing it. That low opinion
was incorrect. It gave that movie far too much credit than it
actually deserved. "Wargames" has got to be the most ridiculous trash
that I have ever seen.
I wonder if those of us in the industry can sue for slander or
libel. After all, the statement that "software designers put in a
'back door' so they can get around any additional security put in
after they leave" is definitely slanderous.
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 14 Feb 84 10:31:49 -0100
From: ole@NTA-VAX (Ole Jorgen Jacobsen)
Subject: Person numbers
To: Lauren@RAND-UNIX
Some thoughs about "Person numbers". We have them here in
Norway too, 11 digits in all; your birthday (in the European format)
and 5 "control digits" some of which are used to tell your sex etc.
(The algorithm is actually quite hairy, I'll see if I can dig it out
if someone is interested.)
Example: 100457 31990 (That's me folks!)
The 100457 says I was born April 10th 1957, the rest is pure magic.
Do I object in any way to this system? Well, it makes it more diffi-
cult to "fool the system", i.e. I cannot skip national service nor
escape the taxman, but as a lawabiding citizen I have no wish to do
either. Should I ever become ill and have to rely on Social Security,
the extra number means an added safety, I can rest assured that "the
other Ole Jacobsen" doesn't get my cheque in the mail.
I can see that there are dangers as with any type of datebase which
contains information about people. However, Norway has as one of
the few countries in Europe (World?) passed a "datalaw" which allows
me to see *any* information which is stored on me in *any* database
in this country and HAVE THEM ALTER IT if I can prove that it is in
any way incorrect or incomplete.
Regards,
<OLE>
<370>
10045731990
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Date: Tue, 14-Feb-84 02:54:05-PST
From: Lauren Weinstein <vortex!lauren@RAND-UNIX>
Subject: person numbers and databases
To: OLE@NTA-VAX
Ole,
I guess I'm just a bit skeptical. It seems to me that a law giving
you access to "all" info collected about you is only fully useful if
you have 100% faith in the "powers-that-be" to always honestly admit
what data has actually been collected and correlated.
For example, how do you know that there isn't a "secret" database
with detailed records regarding your bizarre sexual habits?
(Just kidding, of course, but you get the idea!) Frankly, I'd
much rather see controls on the collection of information rather than
trying to attack the problem "after the fact".
--Lauren--
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Date: Tue, 14 Feb 84 13:07:59 -0100
From: ole@NTA-VAX (Ole Jorgen Jacobsen)
To: vortex!lauren@RAND-UNIX
Subject: Re: person numbers and databases
Lauren,
Point taken, but how do you prevent people from creating such
databases in the first place, and what is the significance of the
person number in this context? It is obvious that the various
bureacracies need some form of database. I'd rather they had a unique
key to distinguish me from John A Random than some mis-typed address.
I forgot to mention that it is *illegal* for a holder of a database to
link it to *another* database by means of the person number. This I
think is where the possible abuses may occur unless strict control is
applied. My bank has no right to find out information such as my
physical (or mental!) condition simply due to the fact that both they
and the social security people sort me by the same number. I have been
led to believe that the Data Inspection are acutely aware of these
problems and make every effort to insure that the correct procedures
are followed. The Data Inspection conduct spot check, they can ring
the doorbell of an insurance agency say and demand to see their system
in operation. ("How do you store your tapes?" "Who has access to the
information?" etc..).
Regards,
<OLE>
<370>
PS. I think much of this is a typical example of the European vs the
American "culture", I am sure the person number thing could never
happen in the US, things which might seem outrageous to you
might well be OK out here and vise versa. It is often easy to
forget this difference in attitude and perspective.
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Date: Tue, 14-Feb-84 14:25:07-PST
From: Lauren Weinstein <vortex!lauren@RAND-UNIX>
Subject: more on person numbers
To: OLE@NTA-VAX
I tend to view person numbers as being just too "convenient" a
mechanism for the cross-linking of databases. I can't help but laugh
at the Swedish government claim that their "integrated" databases
wouldn't show names and would be used for "statistical" purposes only.
Sure... Given that most databases would always link names and
numbers, how hard would it be for them to derive the name for any
given desired entry? C'mon now -- are people really buying that
story? (Apparently not!)
Of course, here in the U.S., we also have what almost amounts to a
person number -- our "social security numbers", so we are certainly
vulnerable to the same sorts of problems as other countries...
--Lauren--
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Date: Tue 14 Feb 84 10:32:48-MST
From: Walt <Haas@UTAH-20.ARPA>
Subject: Privacy and data bases
The issues that we have been talking about hit home to me in the last
week. First, I found out that somebody opened a bank account with my
address and started writing bad checks. Fortunately they just swiped
my address, not my name and social security number. I discussed this
with the local credit bureau, who informed me that it would cost me
$10 to find out what was in my file. They also said that they didn't
keep records of bad checks, and their records were by name, so I
shouldn't be affected. As far as I can see, my best protection is the
fact that anyone who programs for a match on address will come up with
lots of rooming houses; some of the tenants would be honest and some
not, and the data would end up so random nobody would take it
seriously. I'm also crossing my fingers and knocking on wood...
The second thing that brought the issue home to me was the
announcement on the radio this morning that the local US Attorney has
subpoenaed Mountain Bell for the names of everybody who has called the
Dial-a-Porn number! The ACLU is showing a lot if interest [I'm
renewing my member- ship from my next paycheck!] and wants to know
exactly what this zealous individual is planning to do with these
names. I don't think this type of investigation could be conducted
without computers.
Happy 1984 -- Walt
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Date: 15 Feb 1984 01:24:38-EST
From: ima!haddock!johnl@CCA-UNIX
Subject: students with WOMs
The latest issue of "Infoworld" mentions that a think tank
believes that in a few years, all students will be required to
have portables. These (lap-sized, I guess) portables would
have a "write-only memory" recording all test scores and
exams. Only school officials would be able to read the
results in the WOM and would use these results to determine
competency and graduation....
Uh huh. So when your dog eats your WOM, you become an unperson. And
50,000 school officials are going to be able to decode the WOMs, but
nobody else will be able to figure out how. And they'll be able to
correct typograhical errors but nobody else can. There's a reason
that school registrars keep their records inside the office rather
than out in the hall. Give me a break.
John Levine, Levine@YALE.ARPA, ima!johnl
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Date: 14-Feb-84 03:09 PST
From: William Daul Tymshare OAD Cupertino CA <WBD.TYM@OFFICE-2>
Subject: IFIPS SCHEDULES SECURITY MEET (COMPUTERWORLD Feb. 13, 1984)
To: AMP.TYM@OFFICE-2, DEV.TYM@OFFICE-2, SYS.TYM@OFFICE-2
To: MARKET.TYM@OFFICE-2, NH2.TYM@OFFICE-2
TORONTO -- The International Federation for Information Processing
(IFIP) has scheduled its second International Congress and Exhibition
on Computer Security Sept. 10-12 here.
The theme of the congress will be "Computer Security -- a Global
Challenge." Sessions will cover computer security, contingency
planning, data and facility protection and implications of systems
security.
Registration costs $442 prior to May 20, $479 prior to July 30, $516
before Sept. 1 and $553 for late registration from the International
Security Congress, Inc., 160 Duncan Mill Road, Don Mills, Ont., Canada
M3B1Z5.
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End of HUMAN-NETS Digest
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