sf-lovers (06/12/82)
>From JPM@Mit-Ai Sat Jun 12 07:15:23 1982
SF-LOVERS Digest Thursday, 10 Jun 1982 Volume 5 : Issue 67
Today's Topics:
SF Topics - Politics in SF,
SF TV - Dr Who, SF Movies - Sword and the Sorcerer Query &
Star Trek II: The Wrath of Khan,
Random Topics - Commercials at the movies,
SF Books - Star Trek II: The Wrath of Khan,
Spoiler - Star Trek II: The Wrath of Khan
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Date: 10 Jun 1982 at 2107-CDT
From: hjjh at UTEXAS-11
Subject: FEMPRO'S AND UTOPIAS
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ FEMPRO'S AND UTOPIAS ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
You'd think that there might very well be a noticeable connection
between SF books with female protagonists and feminist Utopias. But
except for the 1880 Utopian novel MIZORA: A PROPHECY, and maybe some
of Russ' polemical ones (another gifted storyteller who sold her
birthright for a pot of message), what connection there is is not very
strong.
The theme of an all-female culture/planet crops up every once in a
while in SF, but generally the drawbacks rather than the benefits are
emphasized, as in Edmund Cooper's cruel fempro, GENDER GENOCIDE
(British title, WHO NEEDS MEN?). Since such stories seem to tend to
be told from the viewpoint of a male visitor/intruder, e.g., Poul
Anderson's VIRGIN PLANET, they don't qualify as truly Utopian OR as
fempro's. Charles Eric Maine's ALPH \is/ a fempro, but has the
advanced all-female culture experimenting with re-creation of a male
and considering the re-introduction of that sex as advantageous.
A feminist Utopia beneficial to both sexes forms the background to
Mack Reynolds' AMAZON PLANET, where the viewpoint is again that of a
male visitor. Marion Zimmer Bradley's fempro, THE RUINS OF ISIS has a
viable, strongly female-dominant culture, but \I/ hesitate to call
anything a Utopia where half the people are chattel (even if they
\are/ mere males).
..................
<Peripheral note: I had heard that MZB had trouble getting RUINS OF
ISIS published. This seemed odd, as it was nowhere as sexually
explicit as her WORLDWRECKERS which DAW had handled, \and/ DAW
publishes the Gor series. The stumbling block, she told me, was not
sex per se, but that on Isis she had portrayed a successful culture
which was Lesbian in sex-orientation. \SOME/ things are just too far
beyond the pale (shudder!) even for 'way out SF.>
------------------------------
Date: 10 Jun 1982 at 1930-CDT
From: hjjh at UTEXAS-11
Subject: Politics and Popular Writers
For a "progressive, successful SF author" with a strong political tone
I'd nominate Mack Reynolds.
------------------------------
Date: 09-Jun-1982
From: JONATHAN OSTROWSKY AT GALAXY
Reply-to: "JONATHAN OSTROWSKY AT GALAXY c/o" <Young at DEC-Marlboro>
Subject: thanks and another question
Thanks to all who answered my query a few months back about the origin
of the terms "skren," "nexialist," and "varish."
Now I need some help in settling an argument. I remember Lee Horsley,
who played Talon in "The Sword and the Sorcerer," as Archie Goodwin in
the "Nero Wolfe" TV series that starred William Conrad and aired a
couple of years ago. No one believes this. Can anyone out there
settle this? Thanks.
--Jonathan Ostrowsky
------------------------------
Date: 10 Jun 1982 1519-MDT
From: Michi Wada <WADA at SANDIA>
Subject: Dr. Who 'new' episodes
The 'new' episodes with Peter Davison as "The Doctor" were shown in
England earlier this year. The (Tom Baker) Dr. Who episodes were
syndicated in the U.S. in 2 sets with 3 seasons worth of episodes in
each. No way of knowing when (if ever) the BBC will syndicate the
(Davison) Dr. Who episodes. At this time the only way of seeing the
(Davison) Dr. Who is knowing someone with a VCR and camera copy tapes
of the Davison episodes from England.
------------------------------
Date: 10-Jun-82 11:12:54 PDT (Thursday)
From: Kluger at PARC-MAXC
Subject: Commercials during films
I saw the film "Airplane!" in Basil, Switzerland in May, 1981. In the
middle of the film, 10 minutes of commercials were shown. Most of the
people headed for the lobby.
The lobby's lights were flashed a few minutes before the commercials
were over. Some of the commercials were only slides (stills), others
were more like U.S. TV.
My Swiss friends told me that the commercials were standard practice.
The movie theater we had gone to showed first run films and had two
classes of seating: cheaper chairs were closer to the screen. Cost
for the cheaper seats was about $5 .
Larry Kluger
------------------------------
Date: 10 Jun 1982 1052-PDT
From: Jwagner at OFFICE
Subject: Commercials at the movies
Last night's showing of Dead Men Don't Wear Plaid (what about dead
women?) was preceded by a commercial for Coca Cola. It featured
little thirsty penguins stranded in a desert that luckily had a
snack-bar oasis. Not long ago I saw two commercials for Capri
automobiles on different occasions. The first featured a guy and his
dog who stumble upon a red Capri in the desert and fly, not drive,
away. The second was one of those Hi-tech, New Wave numbers featuring
weird camera angles, screeching music, and bony women lounging around
in unnatural poses. It had the same red Capri. All these commercials
seemed to be longer than a minute -- a captive audience, literally, so
I guess they can get away with it. At the local drive-in, I've seen
commercials of the "Hi-kids-I'm-Ed-Barbara-president-FurnichUSA-and-
I-wanna-help-you-get-started-in-the-credit-world" flavor. These are
Bay Area theaters, by the way.
-- Jim Wagner
------------------------------
Date: 10 June 1982 18:11-EDT
From: Thomas L. Davenport <TLD at MIT-MC>
Subject: Commercials at the movies!
And what about commercials IN the movies? I hear that E.T. features
Star Wars "action figures" and a national pizza chain.
------------------------------
Date: 10 Jun 1982 1332-EDT
From: Bob Clements <CLEMENTS@BBNA>
Subject: Commercials IN the movies
My suspension of disbelief was destroyed by the blatant JVC
advertising in the Superman flick. The huge JVC ad in pseudo-Times
Square that was on screen for many minutes and the JVC TV set in the
diner were pretty crass.
But I was really offended by the Marlboro advertising. What possible
reason was there for Lois to be smoking at all, or Marlboro in
particular (rather than an anonymous non-branded package) except to
entice viewers into following the role model into addiction?
Anyone know how much those companies paid for those ads? The credits
did list someone with a title equivalent to "commercials salesman" (or
sales-entity --- "sales-person" discriminates against non-organic and
non-physical sentients).
/Rcc
------------------------------
Date: 10 Jun 1982 0254-PDT
From: Jim McGrath <CSD.MCGRATH at SU-SCORE>
Subject: Commercials in the movies
Showing merchandise in movies is hardly showing commercials -
afterall, people DO smoke brand name cigarettes, and DO drink Coke.
To NOT display these items would be unrealistic, which in turn can be
artistically fatal. I HATE films which are so abstract that you
cannot identify the local (especially when, as in Superman, you were
SUPPOSE to identify New York). Don't most people on this list
constantly complain about unrealistic details in movies?
If the producers can get another company to pay for mentioning their
names, then fine - that's more money for Lucus and Company to play
around with. As for fears that this could result in reduced artistic
control over the movie: nothing could be worse than the control the
Hollywood studios already exert on creative talents.
Jim
------------------------------
Date: Friday, June 11, 1982 3:39AM
From: Jim McGrath (The Moderator) <JPM at MIT-AI>
Subject: SPOILER WARNING! SPOILER WARNING!
The following messages are the last in the digest. They discuss some
plot details in both the movie and the book Star Trek II: The Wrath
of Khan. Some readers may not wish to read on.
------------------------------
Date: 9 Jun 1982 09:22 EDT
From: PATTERSON.Henr at PARC-MAXC
Subject: Re: Genderless Pronouns???
Speaking of genderless pronouns, both Kirk and Spock refer to Saavik
as Mr. Saavik although Saavik is a Vulcan female. Any additional
comments?
Richard Patterson (PATTERSON.Henr at PARC)
P.S. To TSC::COORS::VICKREY Are you sure that you were not listening
to the morning news?? (re: SF-Lovers Digest V5 #63)
P.P.S. I agree that people should give their full names and mailing
address when writting SF-Lovers.
P.P.P.S. Does anyone know where there is a list of what mailing
address via net are what real locations and normal names. (i.e.
PATTERSON.Henr at PARC is me at Xerox Corp located in Henrietta, New
York).
Richard
------------------------------
Date: 10 Jun 1982 11:19 CDT
From: Surber.DLOS at PARC-MAXC
Reply-to: Stevenson.WBST at PARC-MAXC
Subject: Re: Star Trek II - (nf)
I have been told by a navophile ( a person interested in navies ) that
all junior officers, regardless of sex, were referred to as "Mister"
in the 20th century U.S. and Royal British navies. Apparently Star
Fleet has preserved the historic title.
Doug Surber / Surber.DLOS
------------------------------
Date: 10 June 1982 14:03-EDT (Thursday)
From: Pat O'Donnell <PAO at MIT-EECS>
Subject: SF-LOVERS Digest V5 #64
I, too, was a bit mystified by Kahn's refusal to remove his right
glove. Noticing the metal links, I kept expecting him to backhand
someone with it.
------------------------------
Date: 10 June 1982 18:24-EDT (Thursday)
From: Mijjil (Matthew J. Lecin) <LECIN at GREEN>
Reply-to: Lecin at RUTGERS
Subject: ST:TWOK (not a spoiler)
The glove - no evidence comes from the TV series episode "Space Seed"
- but we can assume that in the devastation Ceti Alpha 5 got when Ceti
Alpha 6 exploded, that his hand could be munged up a bit.
<Mijjil>
------------------------------
Date: 10-Jun-82 12:21AM-EDT (Thu)
From: B.J. Herbison <Herbison at YALE>
Subject: Khan: "I never forget a face."
"I don't know you ... but you I know, Mr. Chekov, I never forget a
face."
This evening I was lucky enough to see *Space Seed* (the Star Trek
episode Khan was introduced in). The crew of the Enterprise was the
normal first season crew - which did not include Chekov. A friend on
mine who KNOWS Star Trek informed me that Chekov joined the crew in
the second season.
Khan's "superior intellect" did some wonderful things, but remembering
the face of a person he never saw tops them all.
B.J.
(Herbison@Yale)
(decvax!yale-comic!herbison)
------------------------------
Date: 10 June 1982 18:28-EDT (Thursday)
From: Mijjil (Matthew J. Lecin) <LECIN at GREEN>
Reply-to: Lecin at RUTGERS
Subject: ST:TWOK - spoiler potential - blooper fer shure
Kahn (when investigating his 2 captives, first to Captain Terrel:):
"I don't know you."
(Then to Checkov)
"But you I know. I never forget a face. Mr. (pause) Checkov,
isn't it?"
They goofed gang!
The episode "Space Seed" aired in the first season, when there WAS NO
CHECKOV character! There was no Checkov that Kahn should remember!
Of course we can always claim the following:
Checkov *WAS* on the Enterprise - he just wasn't BRIDGE CREW yet.
He might have been in the security department, or wherever, and Kahn
met him then - but OFFICIALLY, there was no Checkov first season.
<Mijjil>
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End of SF-LOVERS Digest
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