rogerb@tekmdp.UUCP (06/16/83)
I am looking for an FRP to play and would like some help.. I have played AD&D for about five years now and have gotten stifled into certain classes, races, spells, etc. Things I am looking for are: 1) 'Free-form' classes. That is, there are no 'set' classes-- i.e. if you are a magic-user then you can cast x spells per day, can use only a select kind of weapon... What I want is perhaps something akin to Runequest so that a character can become proficient in whatever he desires. If possible, it would be kind of nice to be able to make up your own spells: knowing that a wizard can only cast spells 1..N makes him a known danger, whereas if a wizard has his own unique sor- ceries, he becomes an enigma. 2) A spell point system for magic. I guess I am just tired of 'gee, all I got left is a couple of 4th level spells and what I really need is a detect magic.' Tunnels & Trolls has one, but T&T doesn't really fit in (easily) with other games. Runequest has one, but the RQ magic system just does not appeal to me overall ( however, since i have not actually played RQ yet, maybe it is not quite so undesirable). The reason I like such a system is to be able to use small inc- rements of magical ability -- powering a magic wand with a D&D first level spell is almost prohibitive, but perhaps using only 1 mana/POW/STR/spell point would not be. 3) A non-AD&D combat system. FRPG's have advanced a long way since AD&D was made, so there must be something better for combat. It would be neat if there were [easier] methods of non-lethal combat than those shown in the DM's Guide. I like armor affecting damage taken as opposed to hit proba- bility, as in Tunnels & Trolls, but that's mere technicality. 4) Lack of discrete levels. It seems kind of unrealistic (sic) to think that after practicing for five weeks or so that one will suddenly gain 5 hit points, become proficient with a new weapon, gain three more spell levels, and save better when (supposedly) you have been practicing this stuff all year. Well, those are the things I would like to have in an FRPG. Things I have looked at include: High Fantasy, a fairly decent FRPG, it's just that I think the combat system is too lethal; Champions, a super-hero RPG I tried to modify for fantasy, but the task escaped my simplicity; Tunnels & Trolls, a game I dismissed almost immediately for its 'cuteness' and incredibly inane spell names; and Runequest, which I haven't played yet, but from browsing through the manual at the bookstore, seems of moderate complexity (but, the magic system doesn't appeal to my tastes a whole lot). Oh, yes, I've also played Fantasy Trip (at least Wizard and Melee), but it seemed to turn me off as a more tactical game (too, I never managed to keep anyone alive for too long in Wizard and Melee). Is there such a game as I am looking for, or am I feebleminded? Does anyone feel as I do, searching for an 'analog' FRPG? Have I missed something in my appraisals of Runequest, Tunnels & Trolls, High Fantasy, or even AD&D? I would certainly appreciate relevant comments. Roger Bonzer Tektronix, Ore
jonab@sdcrdcf.UUCP (06/20/83)
My favorite role playing game is Fantasy Trip. Do not dismiss it in view of only the basic Melee and Wizard modules. The advanced system introduces non-combat skills, and also gives decent rules about setting up dungeons. As to your specific questions: 1) There are only two classes in FT: Magic users and everyone else. However, magic users can learn to use any weapon, and non-magic users can learn spells, but at a premium of skill points. (Skill points are equal to your intelligence, and you can use them for weapon skills, spells, or other non-weapon skills like literacy, horsemanship, thief, detect & remove traps, etc. 2) Fantasy trip has a very simple spell point system. Each spell causes a certain amount of exaustion to the character, which is applied against his hit points, but he can rest and get them back faster than he can heal wounds. 3) Fantasy trip has a non D&D combat system. Each player has a dexterity rating affected by armor and what else he is carrying that he must roll less than to hit. Each weapon then does a different random amount of damage, which is reduced by the targets armor and shield. I prefer this combat system because it is much more realistic and it takes less time to resolve battles. As a GM, I give each player a list of the options he is allowed to choose from each combat round. They are very explicit and cover almost all combat situations. The battles run faster once your players have played a couple of times because he knows exactly what he is capable of doing at each point, and because FT requires a tactical map for the battles, he has no problem visualizing the spatial relationships envolved. 4) No frp game will easily rid itself completely of discrete levels because at some point you have to say that a character is able to do something better than he did before. However Fantasy Trip does a good job at making the levels close enough together that the character does not jump unrealistically in skills. After accumulating enough experience, a character may trade them for one extra point of strength, dexterity, or intelligence. Strength dictates how large a weapon you can swing, and is also equal to the characters hit points. Dexterity is a direct measure of how likely the character is to connect when he swings a weapon, and Intelligence gives how many skills an spells the character may know. So when a character gains a level, he can choose to take more damage, hit his opponents more often, or learn one new spell or skill. The main disadvantage with Fantasy Trip is that there is little aid for a novice game master who is trying to create his own world from scratch. Knowledge of other frp games and a lot of time is required to be able to set up a coherent world. However if all you want to do is design dungeons for the players to explore, it is really no worse than any other game. Jon Biggar
tim@unc.UUCP (06/20/83)
I too have heard good things about the I.C.E. rules. The only major complaint seems to be that the system is very complex, and involves a lot of "table-hopping". According to my brother, the system was originally computerized. Does anyone know about availability of a computer-runnable form of these rules? I recommend RuneQuest strongly. It is to AD&D what UNIX is to VMS. It has a consistent set of "core" rules that make extension easy, instead of the AD&D approach of making up a whole new rule system every time you add something. It is also far more realistic, but not at the expense of playability. I like realism because it makes it easier to identify with the character. Tim Maroney
nessus@mit-eddie.UUCP (Doug Alan) (07/03/83)
I agree with Jon Biggar. The "Fantasy Trip" (which is comprised of "Advanced Mele", "Advanced Wizard", and "In the Labyrinth") is by far the best FRP game on the market. It is better than AD&D, D&D, Basic D&D, T&T, Traveler, DragonQuest and RuneQuest. In fact, only RuneQuest comes anywhere close. I don't like RuneQuest as much because it is more complicated (too complicated) without added realism and is generally not as fun. The only problem with "The Fantasy Trip" (besides a small but important combat rule flaw that is easily fixed) is that the rules are not as organized as they could be. This is not Steve Jackson's (the designer of the game) fault, though. He was screwed by MetaGaming. In fact he left MetaGaming and formed his own company mostly because of the way that they screwed him with the "Fantasy Trip". -- Doug Alan decvax!genrad!mit-eddie!nessus Nessus@MIT-MC
nessus@mit-eddie.UUCP (07/03/83)
I agree with Jon Biggar. The "Fantasy Trip" (which is comprised of "Advanced Mele", "Advanced Wizard", and "In the Labyrinth") is by far the best FRP game on the market. It is better than AD&D, D&D, Basic D&D, T&T, Traveler, DragonQuest and RuneQuest. In fact, only RuneQuest comes anywhere close. I don't like RuneQuest as much because it is more complicated (too complicated) without added realism and is generally not as fun. The only problem with "The Fantasy Trip" (besides a small but important combat rule flaw that is easily fixed) is that the rules are not as organized as they could be. This is not Steve Jackson's (the designer of the game) fault, though. He was screwed by MetaGaming. In fact he left MetaGaming and formed his own company mostly because of the way that they screwed him with the "Fantasy Trip". -- Doug Alan decvax!genrad!mit-eddie!nessus Nessus@MIT-MC
melvin@ucbvax.UUCP (07/18/83)
I have two possible suggestions... 1) The Fantasy Trip (i.e. Advanced Wizard, Advanced Melee, and In the Labyrinth) from Metagaming. It uses a system where you improve your character's stats (Strength, Dexterity, IQ) with experience. Skills and spells take time to learn. The spell system uses mana points to cast an unfortunately limited selection (~100) of spells. You can mix magic with manual skills but it costs. 2) Swordquest from Heritage. This uses a very strange spell point system (the unit of spell casting is a node). The magic is based on a group of 9 (I think) elements and a type of magic involving the essenses of the dead. It too allows the free mixing of magic and weaponry, etc.. A nice system from a strange source. There are also a couple of other games that you might consider look- ing at. Dragonquest from SPI. I haven't had a good look at this; but from the brief peek, it looks promising. The other is Rolemaster from Iron Crown Enterprises. This is a 'realistic' system with a different table for each type of weapon (including fisticuffs, beaks, claws & martial arts tricks). The magic is broken up into various schools with each possessing an \ample/ spell list. Tables abound - one for about any action you could conceive of. Rolemaster is at worst an interesting system. mark yatabe yatabe@ucbmiro