[net.games.frp] Bags of Holding

bb@lanl-a.UUCP (10/27/83)

==============================================================================

A while back I posted a solution to the Kill Orcus problem that involved
getting Orcus into a bag of holding and whisking the bag away to the
Seven Heavens.  I mentioned that that sol'n would work only if the
way the DM understands bags is the same as my own.  How do you out there
(Flame about English -- I wish we had a reasonable 2nd person plural)
handle bags?  I tend to let mine be smaller and lighter than recommended
in the DMG, and I have never burst any of my player's bags for being
overweight (they do tend to be careful about that).  I allow them to get
large items into a bag, telling them that the mouth of the bag seems to
stretch around an object but shrinks very quickly once the article 
is mostly inside.  

Other issues are:  how does one get something out of bag with lots of
stuff in it? (random rolling or does the desired item come into the
pc's hand when she goes for it?)  Can one dump a bag, emptying it of
all of its contents?  Do sharp items placed inside a bag have any
chance of puncturing it?  What happens when one tries to turn a bag
inside out (I just say it turns inside out and nothing is lost -- the
bag looks just the same as always and has the same properties it had
before -- ie, topological transformations in xyz space have no effect
on it.  Can living objects be placed in the bag and if so what happens
to them?  ( I say they come out dead, though dead meat will stay fresh
forever in such a bag -- my pc's have dragon meat stuffed in theirs).
What's the safest way to destroy a bag?  What happens when one places
one bag inside another?  I know that some of these questions have
been answered in the Dragon and in the DMG, but I usually don't like  
their answers about such things, they tend to be explosion happy.

I am  interested in how you handle these issues.  Bags of Holding are
very good items for characters to have, they covet such things and are
very distressed when they lose them.  This last week my group started
with 5 bags (3 of which they stole/won), and ended with 1 (they destroyed
the three and their contents so their owners couldn't trace them, and
had one encased in stone when fighting a xorn) and now the magic user
is essentially level 0 weak, having only a cat familiar and those
spells memorized from the last time he looked at his books.  He is 
not happy and is urging the rest of the group to go and recover the
bag while he stays in the hideout doing the cooking and cleaning.

b2   Bryan Bingham    ...ucbvax!lbl-csam!lanl-a!bb

rigney@uokvax.UUCP (11/09/83)

#R:lanl-a:-320600:uokvax:2400005:000:1627
uokvax!rigney    Oct 30 10:50:00 1983

Back in my [A]D&D days, we allowed living matter in Bags of Holding as
long as they were open to provide an air supply, or when closed as long
as there was enough air (typically a very short time).  This made them
quite useful for smuggling people past guards and such.  Two especially
strange uses are fondly remembered:

		1) The bag was secured to the top of a large fighter's
	helmet, and a platform was placed inside, upon which a hobbit
	could stand and fire arrows while being carried by the fighter,
	yet protected from the waist down.  Thus, we gave a turret to
	the human tank.
		2) The bag was fastened onto a shieldface, with the
	open side facing outwards.  Any arrows that would strike the
	shield would just go into the bag (and could be later recovered,
	if we cared).  If you bags kill whatever goes into them, this
	is deadly indeed for shield rushes and for countering thrusts
	(the thrusting arm enters the bag and dies, frex, not that we
	ran it that way - still, your balance can get really screwed 
	when your weapon doesn't thunk against a shield but rather 
	keeps going...)

Both these tricks work even better with Portable Holes.  The fastening
is left as an exercise for the reader, although it wasn't very hard
to do.

As for turning the bag inside out, from a topological point of view 
couldn't you think of the universe then being inside the bag with
the bag's contents on the outside - no practical difference, perhaps.

As a final thought, what happens when you put a bag of devouring into
a stream while open?

		Carl
		..!ctvax!uokvax!rigney
		..!duke!uok!uokvax!rigney
			or so I'm told...