macintos@pur-ee.UUCP (Burns) (07/18/85)
I would like to know what everyone thinks about the first level clericial spell command. I personally thnik that it is absurd for a first level spell to cause certain doom for characters and monsters unfortunate enough to not have a saving throw against it. This means that a first level cleric can go up to a fifth level fighter and command him to "die" and then chop him to little peices while he is defenseless.
js2j@mhuxt.UUCP (sonntag) (07/18/85)
>I would like to know what everyone thinks about the first level clericial > spell command. I personally thnik that it is absurd for a first level spell to >cause certain doom for characters and monsters unfortunate enough to not have a > saving throw against it. This means that a first level cleric can go up to a >fifth level fighter and command him to "die" and then chop him to little peices > while he is defenseless. Not really. The fighter would just spend one round trying to figure out how to go about "die"-ing. During that round, the cleric and friends could get an undefended swing in on him, but that's hardly the same as chopping him to little pieces. This spell is also useless against any being whose language you don't speak, of course. So once in awhile it lets you get a free attack or two. Not unbalancing for a first level spell. -- Jeff Sonntag ihnp4!mhuxt!js2j "Well I've been burned before, and I know the score, so you won't hear me complain. Are you willing to risk it all, or is your love in vain?"-Dylan
mte@busch.UUCP (Moshe Eliovson) (07/18/85)
In article <3059@pur-ee.UUCP>, macintos@pur-ee.UUCP (Burns) writes: > > This means that a first level cleric can go up to a > fifth level fighter and command him to "die" and then chop him to little peices > while he is defenseless. The nature of the spell prohibits commands such as these. The die might knock the fighter out but no more- and that's clerical power for you. Last year there was a major event in this newsgroup as we compared our favorites. Be careful with this though. I once commanded, "Befriend!" and the guy befriended me- later he assasinated my friend! Moshe Eliovson {allegra, ihnp4}!we53!busch!mte
mff@wuphys.UUCP (Swamp Thing) (07/18/85)
The way we run this spell, a cleric cannot kill a 5th level fighter in 1 round (duration of the spell) because he cannot use sharp weapons. He can hit him over the head with his trusty mace (doing max damage), but can't slit his throat, etc. Not very realistic, perhaps, but it's workable. Besides, this spell isn't didly (at least you get a save) compared to the 1st-level MU spell sleep. It wouldn't effect a 5th level guy, but it wreaks havoc on low-lifes. Mark F. Flynn Department of Physics Washington University St. Louis, MO 63130 ihnp4!wuphys!mff ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ "There is no dark side of the moon, really. Matter of fact, it's all dark." P. Floyd
slb@drutx.UUCP (Sue Brezden) (07/19/85)
> > This means that a first level cleric can go up to a > fifth level fighter and command him to "die" and then chop him to little peices > while he is defenseless. Seems like a waste of a first level spell to me (better used in a heal.) It will only keep the fighter from swinging for one round. And there is a chance of the spell being interupted anyway (although less than most clerical spells. Gods, I hate waiting for 5 segments, 6 segments, even a round for spells to go off!) >>Last year there was a major event in this newsgroup as we >>compared our favorites. I missed this, as I wasn't on the net then. What was the winner? I like "Masturbate". Or is this subject one I shouldn't reopen? -- Sue Brezden Real World: Room 1B17 Net World: ihnp4!drutx!slb AT&T Information Systems 11900 North Pecos Westminster, Co. 80234 (303)538-3829 ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Your god may be dead, but mine aren't. ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
jims@hcrvax.UUCP (Jim Sullivan) (07/19/85)
>I would like to know what everyone thinks about the first level clericial >spell command. I personally thnik that it is absurd for a first level spell to >cause certain doom for characters and monsters unfortunate enough to not have a >saving throw against it. This means that a first level cleric can go up to a >fifth level fighter and command him to "die" and then chop him to little peices >while he is defenseless. > As previously noted, probably not, it takes a long time to kill things, and even 'defenceless' monsters still have lots of hit die. When I'm DMing, I always try to pervert the intention of the command. For example, party is battling a hill giant on a ledge. Cleric cast a command spell, shouting JUMP. Now the cleric assumed that the hill giant would jump off the cliff. Wrong, the hill giant (who was thirty feet away before the spell), jumped at the cleric, arriving in time to hit a few people, and screw up the attacks of the rest of the party. In general, a command is a good spell, but not as powerfull as some players want it to be. Jim Sullivan
holt@convexs.UUCP (07/19/85)
hogwash. First clerics don't use edged weapons, so they won't "chop".
Secondly, the command only lasts for a round. Third, given the speed factor
of clerical weapons, even a super strong cleric is unlikely to be able to
finish the task in a round. Fourth, the cleric will have to move to position
where the "dieing" fighter is, taking time, thus making it impossible to
use the "automatic killing of a sleeping/motionless opponent in 1 round"
rule. Fifth, think of mage spells such as sleep (much, much more powerfull
than clerical command), magic missile, etc, which even though first level
allow no saving throw. Sixth, I believe that characters with reasonable
wisdom do get a saving throw vs. command.
In my opinion, clerical command is one of the few reasonably good
spells in a low level cleric's offensive arsenal. Take it away, and you
further unbalance the power between classes.
Dave Holt
Convex Computer Corp.
{allegra,ihnp4,uiucdcs,ctvax}!convex!convexs!holtmike@genat.UUCP (Mike Stephenson) (07/19/85)
> > I would like to know what everyone thinks about the first level clericial > spell command. I personally thnik that it is absurd for a first level spell to > cause certain doom for characters and monsters unfortunate enough to not have a > saving throw against it. This means that a first level cleric can go up to a > fifth level fighter and command him to "die" and then chop him to little peices > while he is defenseless. The spell "Command" should not be used this way. Commanding someone to "Die" will cause the character fall to the floor as if dead FOR ONLY ONE ROUND. At the end of this time, he/she will get up and do his/her best to bash your head in. Now, on the other hand, this spell has an incredible variety of uses which lend themselves to enjoyment (especially for a Chaotic cleric). For example: "Command word *** regurgitate ***" This gets real messy, especially if you use it against a fighter wearing a helmet with a closed faceplate! Of course, you have to watch it, lest your freshly pressed clerical garb become soiled. Just as a little side exercise, let's see what useful command words are bubbling throughout the warped imaginations of all you gamers out there. Mail me your favorite command words, and I will publish a summary. Mike Stephenson
gamma@ih1ap.UUCP (tontille) (07/19/85)
> > I missed this, as I wasn't on the net then. What was the winner? I > like "Masturbate". Or is this subject one I shouldn't reopen? > That is a good one against a Paladin. 'Vomit' is my personal favorite. Key-Man (and the Masters of Technology).
faustus@ucbcad.UUCP (Wayne A. Christopher) (07/21/85)
> > I would like to know what everyone thinks about the first level > > clericial spell command. I personally thnik that it is absurd for a > > first level spell to cause certain doom for characters and monsters > > unfortunate enough to not have a saving throw against it. This means > > that a first level cleric can go up to a fifth level fighter and > > command him to "die" and then chop him to little pieces while he is > > defenseless. > > Not really. The fighter would just spend one round trying to figure out how to > go about "die"-ing. During that round, the cleric and friends could get an > undefended swing in on him, but that's hardly the same as chopping him to > little pieces. What will happen is that the fighter will fall down as if asleep and you can quickly cut his throat (unless it is heavily armored...). There are rules for killing sleeping characters, so unless you are playing (gasp) non-standard D&D it is pretty useful. The most effective command I have heard, though, is "masturbate"... > This spell is also useless against any being whose language you don't speak, > of course. So once in awhile it lets you get a free attack or two. Not > unbalancing for a first level spell. You have to try to be clever with the spell. Like, you can use a command in conjunction with a "message" spell to cause great confusion among your enemies... According to Gygax, a round is pretty long -- if you commanded somebody to masturbate and he spent a minute doing it, that would be plenty of time for his companions to notice and get pretty disgusted... Wayne
don@umd5.UUCP (07/21/85)
In article <3284@drutx.UUCP> slb@drutx.UUCP (Sue Brezden) writes: >Seems like a waste of a first level spell to me (better used in a heal.) >It will only keep the fighter from swinging for one round. And there is >a chance of the spell being interupted anyway (although less than most >clerical spells. Gods, I hate waiting for 5 segments, 6 segments, even >a round for spells to go off!) > The Command spell does have its uses... After all, it only takes 1 segment to cast! -- --==---==---==-- ___________ _____ ---- _____ \ //---- IDIC ----- _\______//_ ---- ---------- ARPA: don@umd5.ARPA BITNET: don%umd5@umd2 SPOKEN: Chris Sylvain UUCP: {seismo,rlgvax,allegra,brl-bmd,nrl-css}!umcp-cs!cvl!umd5!don
mte@busch.UUCP (Moshe Eliovson) (07/21/85)
******** FLAME ON !!! ******** In article <15300003@convexs>, holt@convexs.UUCP writes: > > hogwash. First clerics don't use edged weapons, so they won't "chop". > Secondly, the command only lasts for a round. Third, given the speed factor > of clerical weapons, even a super strong cleric is unlikely to be able to > finish the task in a round. Fourth, the cleric will have to move to position > where the "dieing" fighter is, taking time, thus making it impossible to > use the "automatic killing of a sleeping/motionless opponent in 1 round" > rule. Fifth, think of mage spells such as sleep (much, much more powerfull > than clerical command), magic missile, etc, which even though first level > allow no saving throw. Sixth, I believe that characters with reasonable > wisdom do get a saving throw vs. command. > ******** reduce to low bonfire !!! ******** Thanks you for providing the first words of my article. H O G W A S H This is not to criticize you personally Dave, it's this type of thinking in general. The world of AD&D is a nasty one folks. Sit down and let me explain it to you. You are a pc, you are out of the ordinary, you have the adventuring spirit whether it be through holiness, the sword or the various facets of the Art, be it nature, illusion or the arcane. Now, to make things fair since you can NOT afford school you've got to adventure for xp, either as an apprentice to a guild, mage or church, or on your own which is much harder friends. Now, out there are established goodies and baddies, right? They got that way through the same methods you wish to employ, Power. If you start fucking with them, YOU are fucked. (In the mind, and soon in body as well.) But, you're not just nobody. You are Modnar, 1st level cleric through whose own wisdom you have learned of the holy power's ability to Command. If you say "die" it is unnatural so it won't work 100% but it sure as hell will cause a major brain contusion for the round! And let's take into consideration that once a npc/pc is asleep it's natural to remain that way, not magically pop up at the end of the one round duration! Furthermore, alot of these rules are out of fairness to the game, I prefer reality. Examples follow: Number one: You are asleep. I hit you over the head with a -15 billion speed factor weapon. You wake up but unfortunately the basic cranial ingredients you once had in a form are now porridge, I don't give a shit if I'm a (heaven forfend!) mundane human or about assasination- this is EXPLICITY stated by MU sleep spell- DEATH, no saving throw. Number two: I am the Grandfather Assasin. I fight dirty and I command the most dedicated deadly horde on this Plane/world/whatever. I'm a mean mother, and everybody whose somebody knows and respects that. Furthermore, I'm an enigma. Nobody knows anything about me without going to some very, very serious efforts (Wish...) Now I decide Joe Cleric Psionic is a pain. I take my ultra-super-expialadoshus poison and I hit him with it. He never had a chance... but what's this????????!!!!!!!!! Gosh, I forgot! Clerics have good saving throws versus poison- and he was wearing his +5 cloak, his talisman vs. poison, his +3 ring and he saved on a -3 or above! Sorry folks, no way, NO WAY! With respect to one of the previous articles, an experienced pc/npc would be able to help himself alot and therefore lower his throw, but in cases such as these- perhaps not so extreme but nonetheless, the rules just don't apply- "The wonder ball goes round and round to pass it quickly you are bound if you're the one.... you... are... dead." Number three: We once ran a high level campaign for the real helluva it no matter how improbable the characters were. I was a mage naturally. Anyway we're playing and all of a sudden right next to ME specifically this "para-ice elemental" pops out of nowhere. So I look around and see our SUPER-NEW Hierophant of the Cabal (aka 23th level druid) looking very inconspicuous indeed. After separating myself with a wall of some sort from this obnoxious elemental and calling over my dear friend the 17th level anti-paladin to take care of it I decide to take drastic measure to prevent the rest of my not so friendly ultra-powerful buddies from interfering. I cast a time stop and tell the dm that I will extend it's time limit as long as neccesary with lim. wish or wish etc. but that I'm going to strangle this fucker.) Now it happened that Justice was with me so I rolled a 15 on the assasination chart, but in all seriousness folks, the Druid was dead, period, no saving throw. UltraChaos is inescapable - and by the way, if those people who meantioned how much they liked having an interested evil pc around need somebody.... Moshe Eliovson (but really Elric of Melnibone') {allegra, ihnp4}!we53!busch!mte
scott@hou2g.UUCP (N. Ersha) (07/22/85)
Posted this (or something like it) the other day, but it never got to MY machine. Apologies if you already saw it. Everyone is talking about killing people/creatures incapacitated via a command spell (in a single round). What about tying them up? Seems this could EASILY be done in one round to a sleeping foe. In fact, the party I DM for did just that, polishing off a high(er) level mage by commanding him to die or sleep (or whatever), and then trussing him up like a Christmas gift. (Not to mention the fact that our Chaotic thief proceeded to lop off his tongue--ugh!--to prevent spell casting "from bondage"). This was just TOO EASY. Any suggestions for modifications? Granted, the spell should be moderately effective (I like to PLAY Clerics too). I just don't think a First-level character ought to have a Save-or-Die spell (or Save-or-Tie, which amounts to the same thing). Mordru the Mixed-Up aka Scott Berry
hutch@shark.UUCP (Stephen Hutchison) (07/23/85)
In article <2044@genat.UUCP> mike@genat.UUCP (Mike Stephenson) writes: >> >> I would like to know what everyone thinks about the first level >> clerical spell command. I personally think that it is absurd for a >> first level spell to cause certain doom for characters and monsters >> unfortunate enough to not have a saving throw against it. This means >> that a first level cleric can go up to a fifth level fighter and >> command him to "die" and then chop him to little pieces while he is >> defenseless. > >The spell "Command" should not be used this way. Commanding someone to >"Die" will cause the character fall to the floor as if dead FOR ONLY ONE >ROUND. At the end of this time, he/she will get up and do his/her best to >bash your head in. > >Now, on the other hand, this spell has an incredible variety of uses which >lend themselves to enjoyment (especially for a Chaotic cleric). For example: > > "Command word *** regurgitate ***" > >This gets real messy, especially if you use it against a fighter wearing >a helmet with a closed faceplate! Of course, you have to watch it, lest >your freshly pressed clerical garb become soiled. > > Mike Stephenson I suppose this is as good a time as any to bring up my personal variation on the Clerical spell "Command", recalling of course that I do NOT play AD&D (tm) rules at all. The English language is definitely NOT structured so that you can give an unambiguous imperative as a single word. Example, "vomit" "I see none" Other languages simply do not allow anything more than the simplest of imperatives to be expressed as a single word. Some, like German, allow extremely complex phrases to be expressed as "single words". Romance languages like Spanish allow a single-word command to indicate not only direct object but to a limited extent, when or how to do something. So, the "one word command" is a crock. However, you COULD construct it so that you give an imperative phrase. An imperative phrase is constructed thus: <article of address> <verb> <adverb> <direct object> <adjective> where article of address disambiguates WHO you are commanding, and is optional if unrequired. verb is any old verb, but it better be one which the critter understands. adverb directly modifies the verb, as "stop BREATHING"; breathing is the adverb here. direct object, as in "swallow that SWORD"; sword is the direct object. adjective directly disambiguates the direct object; "kiss my brown horse" specifies WHICH of the various possibilities is selected. Now, this is presented as an alternative to the more realistic, but uglier, method of requiring the players to actually LEARN (and the Ref to actually CONCOCT, heaven forfend!) the various languages. In this case, the command would have to be expressed IN a victim's language, but the deities have taken the difficulty out of the operation by making it possible for the cleric to issue a command! Admittedly, the Ref must still determine whether there is any ambiguity left, as in "die, stupid orc!" where it could be argued that "stupid orc" doesn't disambiguate, and "die" could be mistaken for a command to change the color of something (in proper context!) ... Also, there is the problem of making sure that the command wasn't idiomatically incorrect, (Pepe', get your sister!) and the command cannot directly cause damage. So, the probability that the cleric phrases a command incorrectly can be set as a function of level, say, 25-level% with a reduction based on how well the cleric (and victim!) know the language, and on how well practiced this particular application of the command is, and on how rushed or hurried the situation is. This, and idiom, and the ability demonstrated on this very net (maybe in this very article) of how poorly people are able to say what they mean, all conspire together to allow the potentially humorous backfire of the Command. Also, I'd make the save vs command based on wisdom, not intelligence. Hutch
slb@drutx.UUCP (Sue Brezden) (07/23/85)
>>Seems like a waste of a first level spell to me (better used in a heal.) >>It will only keep the fighter from swinging for one round. And there is >>a chance of the spell being interupted anyway (although less than most >>clerical spells. Gods, I hate waiting for 5 segments, 6 segments, even >>a round for spells to go off!) >> --Me > >The Command spell does have its uses... After all, it only takes >1 segment to cast! > --Chris Sylvain Uh, that was my point--that it is nice to have one spell at least that is that fast. Sorry if I didn't make my meaning clear. This brings up an idea. If you are really concerned about the power of the command spell (I'm not, but then I'm often a cleric :-)) in your game, you could decree it longer to cast. That would put a dent in it, as it would be harder to cast without interruption--especially against MUs. -- Sue Brezden Real World: Room 1B17 Net World: ihnp4!drutx!slb AT&T Information Systems 11900 North Pecos Westminster, Co. 80234 (303)538-3829 ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Your god may be dead, but mine aren't. ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
rcb@rti-sel.UUCP (Random) (07/24/85)
On the subject of 1 word commands, here is a slight varient designed to give players fits. How about granting them a 1 word wish. With the ambiguity of the english language, there is NO WAY that any 1 word wish could not be distorted by the DM if he/she wanted to. For example, "Fly" a) The party starts flying (the intention) but never stops. b) A giant fly appears and attacks. c) All surrounding objects start to fly randomly (hitting the party) Just a sample of the possibilities of what can be done. -- Random Research Triangle Institute ...!mcnc!rti-sel!rcb
patrick@mcc-db.UUCP (Patrick McGehearty) (07/24/85)
This is in response to Moshe's idea of when sure things are sure. First, there are very few sure things in frp. Otherwise life (in the frp world) would be boring (which is why we play frp :-)) I can think of a number of reasons why Moshe's examples are not as clearcut as he thinks: > Number one: > > You are asleep. I hit you over the head with a -15 billion if the sleep is not magically induced, the victim might wake up before being struck, and roll out of the way, thus only taking partial damage. > > Number two: > > I am the Grandfather Assasin. I fight dirty and I command the > ... > +5 cloak, his talisman vs. poison, his +3 ring and he saved on a -3 or above! > Super nasty poison can have penalties on the save, but seriously, would the highly experienced Grandfather Assasin waste time with poison on a heavy Cleric?? Dieties protect their suppororters in subtle ways. However, the Cleric is not absolutely secure. Mortals always fail saving throws on a 1 or 2. A quick garrote would seem more likely to succeed. > > Number three: > > We once ran a high level campaign for the real helluva it no > matter how improbable the characters were. I was a mage naturally. > ... > interfering. I cast a time stop and tell the dm that I will extend it's > time limit as long as neccesary with lim. wish or wish etc. but that I'm > going to strangle this fucker.) Now it happened that Justice was with me > so I rolled a 15 on the assasination chart, but in all seriousness folks, > the Druid was dead, period, no saving throw. > That Druid must have been awfully slow moving. I agree that once you finish the timestop you have plenty of time and options to finish the Druid, although even then, there are possible problems with wish wording and timing (I always require precise playing in PC vs PC actions), but however did you get the spell off? 9 segments is 54 seconds, with you waving your hands, etc, why didn't he clobber you with his +5 scimitar with a speed factor of 4, thus blowing your spell? After all, for the timestop to work, you must have been within 30' of him. Once you are meleed, the outcome is in serious doubt unless you have a Power Word or wand/staff/rod ready. I fear you would not survive long in the 10-20 level campaign I run in. :-) Actually, vice versa is also true. Local campaign rules about relative speed effects of spell casting, movement, and combat have dramatic effects on combat tactics. The important point is that sure fire situations are boring. Even no saving throw spells such as PW Kill are not guareented. 60+ HPs is a specific, but rings of spell turning, Volley Spells, and Rods of Absorption play havoc with the Power Words, not to mention Cubes of Force and Scrolls of Prot. from Magic and Anti-Magic Spells. I leave other possible protections up to your collective creative conceptions.
john@frog.UUCP (John Woods) (07/24/85)
Welcome to Not Necessarily H O G W A S H > > > The world of AD&D is a nasty one folks. Sit down and let me > explain it to you. You are a pc, you are out of the ordinary, you > have the adventuring spirit whether it be through holiness, the sword > or the various facets of the Art, be it nature, illusion or the arcane. > Quite, but your examples (while examples only) are not entirely unassailable. > > I am the Grandfather Assasin. I fight dirty and I command the > most dedicated deadly horde on this Plane/world/whatever. Now I decide Joe > Cleric Psionic is a pain. I take my ultra-super-expialadoshus poison and I > hit him with it. ... Gosh, I forgot! Clerics have good saving throws versus > poison- and he was wearing his +5 cloak, his talisman vs. poison, his +3 > ring and he saved on a -3 or above! Sorry folks, no way, NO WAY! Let's explore this general topic a moment. First, we are dealing in a universe that provides for the ability to take massive damage (a lance sticking out of your chest? "Give me a break!" However, read Le Chancon de Rolan (The Song of Roland) sometime--this kind of thing is taken for granted in fantasy) and ``saving throws''. Some of this Saving Throw business is blamed on skill at evasion, but let's assume that Ol' Gramps here abandoned subtlety for once, ties Joe P. to an altar, and runs him through with a claymore laced with this super toxin. Dead, obviously. BUT: (1) This is a cleric, apparently an important one, of a god whose power in the world is manifest and obvious. What chance is there that a god, whose interest is aroused, would find a problem like his poor servant being packed full of poison even remotely trying. Yawn! Can't people think of INTERESTING miracles anymore? (2) You have postulated a huge amount of magic on this character. Again, the power of magic is indisputable in the universe in question. Hence, if the magic works, the invincible poison is either neutralized or spirited away (perhaps dumped into the heart of the sun, atom by atom, in 14 nanoseconds, by a friendly and helpful Maxwell's Demon bound to the +3 Backscratcher you forgot to take away). Saving throws border on the supernatural, and you are trying to argue that a standardnatural force is more important. And if you must find an excuse for a first-level fighter's .06% saving throw working despite obvious impossibility, well, perhaps Grampa forgot his coffee this morning and picked up the wrong beaker. "Impossible"? Would you be willing to grant 6 in 10000? Real life is like that--the most certain things go wrong (even my C code has bugs, and we ALL know that I'm perfect!-). > > Number three: > > We once ran a high level campaign for the real helluva it no > matter how improbable the characters were. I was a mage naturally. > interfering. I cast a time stop and tell the dm that I will extend it's > time limit as long as neccesary with lim. wish or wish etc. but that I'm > going to strangle this fucker.) Now it happened that Justice was with me > so I rolled a 15 on the assasination chart, but in all seriousness folks, > the Druid was dead, period, no saving throw. > You're lucky I wasn't the DM: strangle that poor servant of Nature from now until Eternity (as it were) but as soon as you let Time roll on in that area, that Druid is going to START BREATHING with an Awfully sore throat!!!!! Bad planning, I'd call that. Now, if you'd offered to break his neck, I'd be a little happier, or if you had chopped him into tiny pieces, boiled the pieces in acid for a virtual week, burned them, and then sunk into the swamp, I'd say you would have rendered the Druid a solved case, and not even Magic would work (note, however, that however skillful you are with Time magic, the gods can run rings around you -- but in this case, I'd require a Divine Intervention rather than a Saving-Throw-Dispatch-A-Minor-Angel type thing. And, Druids, not serving an interfering god, would be out of luck). Just because something doesn't work in our world of F=dp/dt and conservation of energy, has no implications for a world of Summonings and Wishes. On the other hand, my favorite No Saving Throw magick is to teleport a few tons of rock just above the head of the Bad Nasty (or Good Nasty, depending). This is NOT invincible, of course, but it is pretty close--no time to jump, no time to utter a spell, and even a magick which need by triggered only by a gesture or a thought isn't likely to be triggered by the thought: "OH, SHIT!"... Just to ramble a bit more: on the matter of the Druid above, let us return to the Time Stop and replace the almighty Druid with a first level fighter who can just barely look at you without injury. No chance for him, right? Well, you poise your Sword of Incredibly Painful Death for the killing blow, when a Type VIII Demon appears in front of you, who politely says "Fred's friend, the ArchMage of Time, was terribly broken up by your killing poor Fred here, so he blew three Full Wishes and a case of Old Coke for this. Please don't struggle while I take you to Hell, I'm not being paid hourly, and I want to get this done quickly..." Not likely? Never say never............ After all, anything can happen in Chaos. -- John Woods, Charles River Data Systems, Framingham MA, (617) 626-1101 ...!decvax!frog!john, ...!mit-eddie!jfw, jfw%mit-ccc@MIT-XX.ARPA
faustus@ucbcad.UUCP (Wayne A. Christopher) (07/28/85)
> hogwash. First clerics don't use edged weapons, so they won't "chop". > Secondly, the command only lasts for a round. Third, given the speed factor > of clerical weapons, even a super strong cleric is unlikely to be able to > finish the task in a round. Fourth, the cleric will have to move to position > where the "dieing" fighter is, taking time, thus making it impossible to > use the "automatic killing of a sleeping/motionless opponent in 1 round" > rule. Use common sense - there is a guy lying in front of you, immobile, for one minute. You have a common hammer or something like that. Do you really think you wouldn't be able to kill him? If not, pounding on his face for a minute with a hammer will at least make him unlikely to get up for a LONG time... Wayne
long@oliveb.UUCP (Dave Long) (07/28/85)
In article <98@ucbcad.UUCP> faustus@ucbcad.UUCP (Wayne A. Christopher) writes: | Use common sense - there is a guy lying in front of you, immobile, for | one minute. You have a common hammer or something like that. Do you really | think you wouldn't be able to kill him? If not, pounding on his face | for a minute with a hammer will at least make him unlikely to get up for | a LONG time... In a series of experiments inspired by John Nowak, consisting of subjecting elements of the population (selected by their choice of walking down a local alley on a *dark* night) to impacts in the head and neck with sundry percussion instruments (hammers and reasonable facsimiles thereof), it was found that death, or at least vegetabledom, was incurred in an average of 43 seconds, with ~68% of the sample space being within 4 seconds of the average. Before: After: <- Sample :-) %| <- Diagram (Really, to think that FRPG's instill violent modes of thought, when they actually encourage independant methods of solving problems) --DISCLAIMER-- The above statements are *all* ":-)" D.A.R.C. is in no way connected with this Any resemblance to any experiments, conduc- tive or abhorred is purely coincidental. Dave Long -- {hplabs,fortune,idi,ihnp4,tolerant,allegra,tymix}!oliveb!long
sps@drusd.UUCP (ShaplandSP) (08/01/85)
One of my favorite commands is: Cooperate! This has been particuarly useful when interogating prisoners. S.P. Shapland (aka Marcian Quintella) drusd!sps (AT&T ISL, Denver)
friesen@psivax.UUCP (Stanley Friesen) (08/01/85)
In article <238@frog.UUCP> john@frog.UUCP (John Woods) writes: > >On the other hand, my favorite No Saving Throw magick is to teleport a few >tons of rock just above the head of the Bad Nasty (or Good Nasty, depending). >This is NOT invincible, of course, but it is pretty close--no time to jump, >no time to utter a spell, and even a magick which need by triggered only by >a gesture or a thought isn't likely to be triggered by the thought: "OH, >SHIT!"... > Why not? Aftyer all if I were setting up my Sure-fire-Gaurenteed Protection_from-Anything spell to be triggered on a thought or word I would most certainly choose an appropriate one! "OH SHIT!" certainly is appropriate, since it means I AM IN BIG TROUBLE! -- Sarima (Stanley Friesen) {trwrb|allegra|cbosgd|hplabs|ihnp4|aero!uscvax!akgua}!sdcrdcf!psivax!friesen or {ttdica|quad1|bellcore|scgvaxd}!psivax!friesen
peter@kitty.UUCP (Peter DaSilva) (08/05/85)
> Why not? Aftyer all if I were setting up my Sure-fire-Gaurenteed > Protection_from-Anything spell to be triggered on a thought or word I > would most certainly choose an appropriate one! "OH SHIT!" certainly > is appropriate, since it means I AM IN BIG TROUBLE! Or it means you just walked through a cow-pasture.
biep@klipper.UUCP (J. A. "Biep" Durieux) (08/06/85)
In article <80@ucbcad.UUCP> faustus@ucbcad.UUCP (Wayne A. Christopher) writes: >> > I would like to know what everyone thinks about the first level >> > clericial spell command. >The most effective command I have heard, though, is "masturbate"... > > Wayne Can't that be interpreted as a transitive verb by the "victim"? Could be rather annoying, since it seems reasonable to me that he would try to remove your armour (by any means) first! -- Biep. {seismo|decvax|philabs|garfield|okstate}!mcvax!vu44!klipper!biep while :;do SG=`expr '(' $SG + 1 ')' % $SGS`;cat .sigs/$SG > .signature;done&