andrews@ubc-cs.UUCP (Jamie Andrews) (10/02/85)
In article <57@drutx.UUCP> slb@drutx.UUCP (Sue Brezden) writes: >The question is: Can you read a scroll while invisible? >I would have said no--but figured it was worth a try. I argued >that if you could not see your personal effects, it would make it >difficult to wield a weapon, climb, etc. and you should be at >minuses while invisible--which you are not. Our DM bought that, >and ruled it ok. Here we are back at defining what it is that actually happens when you go invisible. It's futile to try to define exactly what the effects are if the *effects* are supernatural; the best one can do is define the effects naturally and assume that the agency is supernatural. Here are my two best approximations. The "illusion" approach: the other characters simply act as if they were hypnotized and told that you and your personal effects were not there, and they act accordingly. (When someone is hypnotized and told that that chair in the middle of the room is not there, and then asked to walk across the room, he just calmly goes around the chair.) Any actual contact with the "invisible" character breaks the spell, though. This would be a good inter- pretation of the illusionist version of the spell. The "physical" approach: you and your effects are made transparent to visible light, although you still reflect and emit infrared light. You therefore disappear to all those not using infravision, and you perceive things as if you were using infra- vision. Note that this is somewhat similar to Tolkien's descrip- tion of perception when wearing the Ring. By the first definition, you should have no problem reading the scroll. By the second, you should only be able to read the scroll if it has been inscribed with heat-emitting or -reflecting ink. >As it turned out, I wish she had not--the teleport was low, and >Daedin ended up entombed in solid rock, along with a lot of the >party's magic which he was carrying. It was too bad, he was a >lot of fun--LE sadistic alcoholic that he was. >The other two did finish off the lich. They also spent a lot of >time looking for Daedin. "Wonder where the little jerk went?" >"No idea, he just disappeared--maybe went for a drink?" Try this "physical" definition of teleportation on for size: the object is slipped off 3-space at point A, and taken through 4-space to point B, which has been brought close to A by warping 3-space. The caster uses his own strength to push aside any obstacles (air, water, rock, etc.) at B, and if he isn't strong enough, the object is left permanently in 4-space. Alternatively, the object could just return to point A, or it could be "slid along" the surface of 3-space to the nearest point which offered no resistance; these could be defined as more complex versions of the same spell. Note that as far as 4-space goes, nothing is "enclosed" in anything else (think of the 2-dimensional analogy), so there's a chance that during the trip one's backpack contents could end up outside the backpack, vial contents outside the vial, clothes no longer surrounding the body, etc. If you want to give the chance of a penalty to players using teleport, I think this is it. --Jamie. ...!ihpn4!alberta!ubc-vision!ubc-cs!andrews "Autumn, to me the most congenial of seasons; the university, to me the most congenial of lives." --R.Davies
hutch@shark.UUCP (Stephen Hutchison) (10/04/85)
In article <34@ubc-cs.UUCP> andrews@ubc-cs.UUCP (Jamie Andrews) writes: >In article <57@drutx.UUCP> slb@drutx.UUCP (Sue Brezden) writes: >>The question is: Can you read a scroll while invisible? >>I would have said no--but figured it was worth a try. I argued >>that if you could not see your personal effects, it would make it >>difficult to wield a weapon, climb, etc. and you should be at >>minuses while invisible--which you are not. Our DM bought that, >>and ruled it ok. > Here we are back at defining what it is that actually happens >when you go invisible. I don't know it that is really necessary. The spell description indicates that any offensive act cancels the invisibility. I have seen campaigns where any spellcasting was considered the equivalent of an offensive act. Also, the spell description avoids the issue of whether or not the invisoid can see itself, but discussion in Sage Advice in Dragon tm Magazine has indicated that the invisible creature CAN see itself, but cannot cast spells. On the other hand, they've contradicted themselves any number of times by indicating that clerics, at least, can do so. Hutch