[net.cycle] Sidecars - Any recommendations?

dob@ihuxj.UUCP (Daniel M. O'Brien) (09/05/84)

I have raised my sights a little and am now aspiring for
a HONDA SABRE (65 cu.in.?). And with all that power, why
not use it to pull a sidecar? But alas, I know nothing about
them. Driveability?, Safety?, Price?, Distributors?, etc...???

So, how about some discussion on this topic. 

Thanks.
-- 
		
			Daniel M. O'Brien
			AT&T Bell Laboratories
			IH 4A-258
			Naperville, IL 60566
		
			....!ihuxj!dob
		

animal@ihuxq.UUCP (D. Starr) (09/07/84)

Newsgroups: net.cycle
Subject: Re: Sidecars - Any recommendations? (Post to answers to net!)
References: <675@ihuxj.UUCP>

<DO NOT BITE TIRES WHILE MOTORCYCLE IS IN MOTION>

According to U. S. Honda, sidecar recommendations can be summed up
in a single word:

	"DON'T!"

Check out the "Downtime Files" in the October issue of Road Rider for
a discussion of what you can and can't put a sidecar on.  If you don't
get Road Rider (shame on you!) highlights follow:

As far as they can tell, only two manufacturers currently build motorcycles
which are designed for sidecar use.  You can put a sidecar on a big Moto
Guzzi (850 or 1000cc) without voiding the warranty; you can do the same
on a big Harley-Davidson (take THAT, rice-burners!), and they will even
sell you one as an option on some models (price: about $12K for bike and
sidecar--ugh!).  I somehow suspect that you would find the performance of
both of these marques a bit disappointing.

All Japanese manufacturers specifically recommend AGAINST adding a sidecar.
The engineering people talk about side loading that the frame isn't made
for; the legal eagles just say it voids the warranty.  This applies to
ALL models.

The agency which certifies motor vehicles for safety in Germany has 
approved a couple of Japanese frames for sidecar use (I think the Gold
Wing and the KZ1300), but only if the EML leading-link fork is installed
on the bikes.

On the other hand, a lot of people run sidecars on Japanese bikes without
apparent mishap.  I tend to doubt that the frame or forks will actually
break if you put a hack on a Sabre; what's more likely is that the bike
will handle "funny" (e. g., speed wobble or other lack of desire to go
straight) when you take the sidecar off.

Your best bet by a long shot is to talk to people who own sidecar rigs
and see what kind of problems they experience.  Try the United Sidecar
Association (their address is in this month's AMA magazine [what? you're
not an AMA member?  Double shame on you!!]), or try going to Art's (aka
Gee-Gee's, aka Highland House; Routes 22 and 41 in Highland Park, Ill.)
on a Sunday morning.  There are ususally a few hacks parked among the
hundreds of other bikers for the tire-kicking services.

			Have fun,

			Dan Starr
			AMA No. 121989
			Road Runners M. C.

mp@u1100a.UUCP (Mike A Pilla) (09/07/84)

It has been several years since I have "driven" a chair rig but I think
the problems are still the same:
1) frame flex (the SABRE may have insufficient mounting stiffness)
2) gearing (need lots of low end power)
3) chair set-up

Chair set-up depends upon the type of roads you'll ride; e.g. high crown,
flat, etc. (this determines the amount of "lean-out" of the bike when
on flat ground).  Desired stability affects chair "toe-in" (this is the
amount the sidecar wheel points towards the fron wheel
-- 

			Michael Pilla
			Bell Communications Research
			201-981-7290
			{ihnp4,allegra,pyuxww}!u1100a!mp

joe@zinfandel.UUCP (09/23/84)

sidecars...

Hello.

	I want to discourage you from getting a sidecar. At the very
least you should find a way to try driving one before paying for one.
They were developed historically as ways to use an existing power source
( the bike ) to transport more cargo in an attempt to avoid the cost of
a car. The result was and is a quirky, instable vehicle that takes a
special totally un-bike-like riding technique to avoid tipping it over
or even steering it. Misapplications of throttle or brakes  can thwart
your attempts to aim this creature owing to the offset of power delivery
from the center of weight. The high center of gravity becomes crucial in
its instability now that the bike can't lean. The frame was NOT DESIGNED
to take the considerable side loads the side car gives it and usually
warps the frame permanently.
	Have you ever tried riding a bicycle with training wheels since
you learned to ride a bike? It's the same only worse. You'll get all the
vulnerability of a bike with none of the manuverability. If you want
the wind in your hair and capacity for grocery bags you would be better
off with a small open topped sports car. A side car rig is a fun toy
for a very few, but there are good reasons why you don't see any being
used. They enjoy their most devoted following in England where the laws
limit drivers of age sixteen to eighteen to motorcycles of small dis-
placement and three-wheelers ( for some odd reason ). Sidecars were then
so unsporty that they perhaps seemed no medium for teenage high jinks.
After the war three wheeled "bikes" were quickly evolved to resemble
cars as much as possible with full bodies, doors, windows etc. to
capture the market of people to poor or young to own cars. Even today
you can find these three wheeled cars in england ( mainly in motorcycle
magazines ). Given man's competitive nature sidecar races began which
are now the only reliable place to look to find side cars in use. You
will note that racing side cars are as close to motorcycles as they
are to cruise missiles, with car racing tires, formula 1 type bodies,
and limited movement for the "monkey" or passenger. And don't forget
that a sidecar handles radically differently when there is no passenger
from when there is. You might try carrying sand bags. My sarcasm is
only partly fun. I'm also trying to underline the inconvenience and
danger in these cute historical anacronisms.

				Joe Weinstein