[fa.info-cpm] results of search for a cheap micro

C70:info-cpm (06/23/82)

>From W8SDZ@Mit-Mc Wed Jun 23 03:14:10 1982
Date: 22 Jun 82 17:30:04-PDT (Tue)
From: menlo70!sri-unix!cca.decvax!harpo!presby!aron at Berkeley
To:   info-micro at mit-ai
Re:   results of search for a cheap micro
Article-I.D.: presby.172
Via:  news.usenet; 22 Jun 82 22:42-PDT

A while ago I send out a request for info on a cheap micro that met the
following specs: Z-80, 64K, two serial ports and maybe a parallel port
with a built in 80x24 screen optional.  I also did extensive research
on my own via the hefty advertising in BYTE.  The results: First the
bad news - unless you want to build it yourself (which I don't) or you
don't need much support (I do need some) the cheap micro doesn't exist.
Given the sum of the costs of the parts, and with Osborne as an example
it should.  The good news is: in a few months the cheap micro will be a
reality.

Now for specifics:

Currently, the cheapest machine with a built in monitor is the Osborne.
It is unacceptable however because of the 5" screen and single-density
drives (a joke, really). The much heralded double-sided option is in
limbo for the moment.  A competitor, KAYCOMP, with a 9" inch screen
(but also ss drives) should be out soon.  It's quality is unknown. By
the way, as far as I'm concerned, getting Wordstar for free is no big
deal - it's not worth much more than that.

>From the $1795 for the Osborne, there is a big jump to the next system
with a build in screen - the Televideo 802 (I skip over the Superbrain
because of its horrendous reputation).  This meets all the specs - it
has two double-sided double-density floppies built into a 950 cabinet.
It has 2 serial one parallel port.  It lists for $3500, but can be
bought for as low as $2600 if you're willing to go mail-order.  I can
get it discounted from a local dealer.  It's nearest competitor is the
NS Advantage, which has the same specs except you have to pay extra for
serial and parallel ports!!  There were some reliability problems in
early versions of the Advantage, which have been shaken out I hear.

As far as systems in a box without a monitor or terminal, Televideo has
an 801, but since it's only $200 cheaper than the 802, I don't know why
anyone would buy it (unless they hated Televideo terminals). Colonial
Data has what appears to be a nice system for $2400 (see BYTE) which
has a close competitor in the Epic Episode. Support for these latter
systems and quality is an unknown.

You can also build your own, using the SB80 (basis of the Colonial
Data) or the big board (basis of the Xerox 820 - a machine Xerox is
phasing out).

All the rest - Zenith, Altos, Morrow Designs, Godbout, Cromemco, Vector
Graphics etc. etc. come in higher than the above for configurations
that meet my specs.  Even the Japanese let me down: e.g. Sanyo has a
system for $1995 with one floppy, which becomes $2995 if you add a
second floppy!!  The NEC PC-8001, as described in some past issue of
BYTE, did not sound like a machine I wanted to get involved with ( I
forgot to mention CP/M based as a prime criteria of my el-cheapo!).

But the good news is that Cromemco and Morrow Designs have both
introduced systems that should meet my specs with flying colors.  The
Cromemco is called the C-10, and with one floppy it costs around $1500
including a monitor.  The only note of discord is there is no mention
of the availability of a second floppy.  A guy at Computerworld said
that he understood a second floppy would not be an option.  If that's
true, Cromemco has blown it!  Morrow Design's Micro-Decision will be
$1100 with one floppy, $1500 with two, but without a terminal.  Both
systems come with a lot of software ala Osborne.

Caveats:  Delivery on these systems are promised for September.  Given
their price and the reputation of their makers, there will probably be
a 90 day wait before you can get your hands on one.  Also, despite
their maker's reputation, there will probably be a six month quality
shakedown period.  So figure by next spring a micro that meets my specs
will be available at a reasonable price.  But by then I'll probably be
looking at some of the new 16-bitters......

C70:info-cpm (06/24/82)

>From PERILLI@Afsc-Hq Wed Jun 23 20:18:25 1982

Heres an update on your Kaycomp data:

The Kaycomp has DD (200K per drive) dual drives.  It includes a 9"
green 80x24 CRT, one serial port and one Centronics compatible
printer port.  The keyboard is a dead ringer for a VT-100 keyboard (is
DEC unloading surplus keyboards?).  Software included is CP/M 2.2,
SBASIC (structured BASIC?), SELECT (word processor), PROFITPLAN
(spread sheet) and UTILYZE (menu system for CP/M commands).  MBASIC
is optional.  It sells for $1795 and my local dealer assures me he
will have a demo unit "any day now".  The software provided is of
questionable value, but the unit sounds like a good buy based on the
hardware alone.  It has a metal case and weighs 26 lb.

---Chuck
-------

C70:info-cpm (06/25/82)

>From W8SDZ@Mit-Mc Fri Jun 25 12:32:06 1982
Date: 24 June 1982 02:14-EDT
From: Jerry E. Pournelle <POURNE>
To:   W8SDZ
Re:   [menlo70!sri-unix!cca.decvax!harpo!presby!aron: results of search for a cheap micro]

I am also told there is an update kit to make your vt-100 terminal
into a vt-180 computer, z-80 type.  They are said to be sending me
one, but I do not have it yet, so cannot comment on utility.  The DEC
saleslady said you can install the update kit in your vt-100 in about
half an hour.
	I also don't know the cost, but it is of course in
addition to a vt-100 terminal.