wmartin (08/10/82)
This is NOT a general aviation question; it relates to commercial flights: I've been taking flights for business purposes about once a month for a while this year. Every flight, ecept one night flight, has been delayed at the gate for 20-40 minutes due to being held at the gate by the air traffic controllers, according to pilots' announcements. They usually explain how this is better than circling at the destination, saves fuel, and suchlike. I agree with this reasoning; it is logical. But why on earth are the flights scheduled for time "n" and then delayed for 30 minutes at all?!?!? Why aren't they SCHEDULED for time "n + 30" to start with? Can anyone explain the reasoning behind paying the crew and loading the plane that extra 30 minutes ahead of when they can take off? As I said, this affected EVERY flight I took during prime time, so what would be wrong with just slipping all the schedules? Bemusedly, Will Martin
PS@MIT-MC@sri-unix (08/12/82)
From: Peter E. Seissler <PS at MIT-MC> The antique ATC computers (read abacus) can only predict loads so well. I suspect that as departure time come near, they reevaluate the load on the route (particularly for short runs), and reissue release times. I've had some delays since the strike, but not always . Perhaps you've just been unlucky. Remember, controller workload can also vary with personell numbers (i.e. sector cosolidation). The airlines can't change the schedule on short notice (people have made reservations), so they must play it by ear. Pete
wagner (08/14/82)
I also experienced an on-ground hold - in my case, for ATC at the destination of the flight. Since I had to make a connection there, I was a little concerned. But I did have 45 minutes to make the connection, and the hold was only for 15 minutes. Well, to make a long story short, we were held for an hour. ATC kept us in LA to relieve a congestion problem at Ohare, but the congestion problem couldnt have been all that bad - they let the Chicago-Toronto connecting flight out right on time. So I spent the night in Ohare. Only partly paid for by the airline, by the way. 2 Questions: 1) Why is congestion less of a problem for the landing plane than the plane taking off? Or was the congestion problem on the ground? Incidentally, it wasnt just a few people making the connection - about 30 of us. 2) The airline found me a sheet of paper claiming that they are no longer liable for the cost of puttingme up if ATC made them do it. Do anyone know if this is for real or not? How do I check that ATC really did it to me? I have only the airlines say so - and it is clearly in their best interests to say so. And if so, how do I express to ATC my feelings about their being unable to handle regularly scheduled flights? I dont mind them cutting down their comittments because Reagan gave it to them in the ear, but I do resent the airlines not being able to come through on their comittment to get me home for essentially predictable load reasons. From the point of view of the user (me), ATC is part of the transportation (like the works department for a road), and if the bus company and the repair department cant co-ordinate their schedules with repairs, I think I have a right to complain. What do other people think? Michael Wagner, UTCS